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Originally Posted by Ducttape
(Post 2718160)
Seems you’re new to the airline world, remember this works both ways.
CRM is a two way street. So passive aggressively reading the before push checklist during the push is just as bad as not doing it at all. It’s to catch things before the push, not during. So if you are in a position where you are not able to compete this checklist, for whatever reason, you need to ask the CA to hold pushes in the future to do this checklist. It’s not being passive aggressive by 1)complaining on a forum 2) reading it during the push to “get it on the CVR” or 3)you calling to “stop push” on your own. If I forgot a checklist and the FO said nothing but got on the intercom to “stop push” to the tug, you have failed as have I. CRM exists for a reason. It’s not there to sulk and complain from the right seat about how “old and non compliant” the CA is and not for him to sit and grumble about “these new FOs trying to run the show”. It’s to save your lives and the pax in the back. Decades of CRM saving lives backs this up. Time to maybe take a step back and ask what you can do better as an FO to promote healthy CRM ( We really need a like button) |
Originally Posted by Ducttape
(Post 2718160)
Seems you’re new to the airline world, remember this works both ways.
CRM is a two way street. So passive aggressively reading the before push checklist during the push is just as bad as not doing it at all. It’s to catch things before the push, not during. So if you are in a position where you are not able to compete this checklist, for whatever reason, you need to ask the CA to hold pushes in the future to do this checklist. It’s not being passive aggressive by 1)complaining on a forum 2) reading it during the push to “get it on the CVR” or 3)you calling to “stop push” on your own. If I forgot a checklist and the FO said nothing but got on the intercom to “stop push” to the tug, you have failed as have I. CRM exists for a reason. It’s not there to sulk and complain from the right seat about how “old and non compliant” the CA is and not for him to sit and grumble about “these new FOs trying to run the show”. It’s to save your lives and the pax in the back. Decades of CRM saving lives backs this up. Time to maybe take a step back and ask what you can do better as an FO to promote healthy CRM These younger group of millennial FOs I've flown with over the past couple of years are like a Star Trek convention. Everybody wants to be a captain. Very irritating and a challenge to good CRM. |
Originally Posted by butthert
(Post 2718654)
Yeah this is right on.
These younger group of millennial FOs I've flown with over the past couple of years are like a Star Trek convention. Everybody wants to be a captain. Very irritating and a challenge to good CRM. When I was an FO I felt that my job was to make the Captain’s job as easy as possible. Most FOs do a good job but in regards to the complaints above most can be traced to an attitude of anxiously waiting to correct me as the Captain instead of using your knowledge to help me. I get zero joy out of pointing out errors of FOs and usually wait out mistakes so they can figure them out. If it isn’t unsafe or against SOPs let it ride. |
Originally Posted by butthert
(Post 2718654)
Yeah this is right on.
These younger group of millennial FOs I've flown with over the past couple of years are like a Star Trek convention. Everybody wants to be a captain. Very irritating and a challenge to good CRM. |
Originally Posted by Ducttape
(Post 2718160)
CRM is a two way street. So passive aggressively reading the before push checklist during the push is just as bad as not doing it at all. It’s to catch things before the push, not during. So if you are in a position where you are not able to compete this checklist, for whatever reason, you need to ask the CA to hold pushes in the future to do this checklist.
Originally Posted by labbats
(Post 2718703)
When I was an FO I felt that my job was to make the Captain’s job as easy as possible.
Most FOs do a good job but in regards to the complaints above most can be traced to an attitude of anxiously waiting to correct me as the Captain instead of using your knowledge to help me. I get zero joy out of pointing out errors of FOs and usually wait out mistakes so they can figure them out. If it isn’t unsafe or against SOPs let it ride. |
Originally Posted by labbats
(Post 2718703)
When I was an FO I felt that my job was to make the Captain’s job as easy as possible.
Most FOs do a good job but in regards to the complaints above most can be traced to an attitude of anxiously waiting to correct me as the Captain instead of using your knowledge to help me. I get zero joy out of pointing out errors of FOs and usually wait out mistakes so they can figure them out. If it isn’t unsafe or against SOPs let it ride. |
TOTD: everyone trying to measure the length of their CRM skills ITT
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Originally Posted by OOfff
(Post 2719216)
TOTD: everyone trying to measure the length of their CRM skills ITT
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Originally Posted by Jaww
(Post 2719226)
Mine are bigger.
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It's all in how you use it
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