Airline Pilot Central Forums

Airline Pilot Central Forums (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/)
-   Hangar Talk (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/hangar-talk/)
-   -   Tool of the day (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/hangar-talk/66729-tool-day.html)

Packrat 02-26-2014 12:39 AM

Sorry, Kids, I disagree. When I upgraded to the 737-400, F/Os had a 4 hour systems oral. Captains had a 6 hour systems oral.

I agree. That was probably overkill. However, you clowns don't even know the basics about how the systems of your aircraft work. In the military, the operative theory was "know your weapons system." In basic training, they made us assemble an M-14 blindfolded. Granted, it never was useful, but it emphasized that you needed to know your weapons platform intimately.

I hated having to be able to explain the process of one molecule of carbon from a Pterodactyl carcass to the tailpipe of a 737. Today, I can ask an F/O if he knows what the Pressurization knob controls in a 737 and they not only have no clue, but they don't even know the nomenclature of the system involved. For those of you who don't know, the answer isn't the pressurization system...its the Cruise Relay.

I recently spoke to a SWA Captain who had no idea the SFP package was installed in their 737-800s. Apparently, SWA didn't feel it was necessary to tell their pilots that the system was installed on their -800s. While it is standard equipment on the -900s, its an option on the -800s.

He mentioned he had done a F25 takeoff. That's when I told him if he had done an F25 takeoff, the SFP package was on his airplane. Not only was he completely ignorant of the fact, he didn't know that the LE Flaps on his airplane didn't go to Full Extend until the flap handle was moved out of the F25 detent.

"No wonder it didn't slow down," he said.

Sad.

Know your weapons system, boys. Its a matter of pride.

captjns 02-26-2014 02:29 AM


Originally Posted by CanoePilot (Post 1589760)
Thankfully those days are over and knowing what kind of blots hold the engine on the pylon is useless info. Training is more practical in this day in age and not ego driven by a few eggheads in the training department.

On the contrary, as the regionals are the new puppy mills creating the next generation of the magenta line. What a shame. I took those disciplines given me from the trusty 727 over to the NG.

I took it upon myself to learn other neuances of the NG not covered during training that may save save the day. I find the younger instructors know nothing beyond the covers of the FCOM. Question asked met with the response... "you don't need to know that.". Quite different overseas however. Most instructors are not pilots. You may not have to "know that". But you'll get an answer to every question.

Canoe asserts

how much tire pressure is required does nothing but waste everyone's time in training.
I guess Canoe never landed on a wet runway with the anti-skid inop. Hydroplaining Speed? Pretty important to me. Possibly to those under certain conditions too. But hey, I'm "Old School".

The old saying goes for all the Canoes in the cockpits all over the world... "A type rating, a plastic card issued by the FAA, and four stripes, a Captain does not make".

By the way where in the heck is a blot located on the aircraft? Is it aircraft specific?

Boomer 02-26-2014 04:20 AM


Originally Posted by tsquare (Post 1589868)

Oh, and what's a "blot"?

You don't know what a blot is? And you call yourself a professional? :)

680crewchief 02-26-2014 04:22 AM

It's right next to the neuance.

Boomer 02-26-2014 04:32 AM


Originally Posted by captjns (Post 1590059)
I guess Canoe never landed on a wet runway with the anti-skid inop. Hydroplaining Speed? Pretty important to me. Possibly to those under certain conditions too...

I never understood the FAA's hydroplaning formula. It doesn't take into account the depth of contaminant, runway design, aircraft weight, tire width or distance between them on the gear assy, tire tread (or lack thereof)...

If TP is the only factor in hydroplaning, bald tires would be fine on your car as long as they're pumped up really good... :confused:

tsquare 02-26-2014 05:02 AM


Originally Posted by CanoePilot (Post 1589963)
Knowing how high the nose wheel strut sits off the ground and how much tire pressure is required does nothing but waste everyone's time in training. There is much more critical information and training that should be done. Thankfully the philosophy in training these days is much more reality based where if you can't fix it via the QRH or switch then it's best left to the MX guys.

Yes I am young (probably the same age as some of your kids) and that should have nothing to do with anything. It looks like I've struck a nerve with some people who wish it was still the 1960's glory days of aviation when captains were worshiped by everyone they came into contact with, when cockpit crews had 4 people, when passengers wore suits and the pilots all had "panel time" and an a&p course or two. Here is another shocker, in about 30 years the tom cruise top gun guys with square jaws, a Harley and to cute blondes on each arm will be replaced with an enlisted or contract guy weighing about 300 lbs in a air conditioned trailer commanding a drone. Times change, I'd still like a milk man to bring me ice cream and milk but these days I need to go to trader joes for that.

No... what you are displaying is a high level of immaturity. I absolutely hated learning to draw the electrical schematic system on the 727. Hated it. Felt exactly the same way as you are now advocating as a matter of fact. Now... 20 years later, I see there was a purpose in it. You are a classic end user. As long as it works, you're good to go. If there's a problem, somebody (hopefully) has figured out what to do, and will tell you. That is quite sad actually... and someday you might understand. It has nothing to do with going back to the glory days of the 60s or anything like that. It has to do with knowing your airplane. We are losing that part of our professionalism. Reading a checklist might be fine for you, but I prefer knowing more about my craft. An FO can be replaced with a fresh out of a six week "crash course" on reading English if things continue down the road you seem to adore. Fine with me, YOU are gonna have to keep your eye on 'em so that they don't throw down the gear mid flight, or shut down an engine or two.... because , hey, "there's a checklist for restarting the engine.. I saw it in the sim"....

Oh, and I don't have any kids....

CanoePilot 02-26-2014 05:21 AM


Originally Posted by tsquare (Post 1590119)
No... what you are displaying is a high level of immaturity. I absolutely hated learning to draw the electrical schematic system on the 727. Hated it. Felt exactly the same way as you are now advocating as a matter of fact. Now... 20 years later, I see there was a purpose in it. You are a classic end user. As long as it works, you're good to go. If there's a problem, somebody (hopefully) has figured out what to do, and will tell you. That is quite sad actually... and someday you might understand. It has nothing to do with going back to the glory days of the 60s or anything like that. It has to do with knowing your airplane. We are losing that part of our professionalism. Reading a checklist might be fine for you, but I prefer knowing more about my craft. An FO can be replaced with a fresh out of a six week "crash course" on reading English if things continue down the road you seem to adore. Fine with me, YOU are gonna have to keep your eye on 'em so that they don't throw down the gear mid flight, or shut down an engine or two.... because , hey, "there's a checklist for restarting the engine.. I saw it in the sim"....

Oh, and I don't have any kids....

I really fail to see how drawing out and memorizing the electrical schematic has any practicality.

badflaps 02-26-2014 05:23 AM

Useless information is stuff that hasn't happened to you..............yet.

tsquare 02-26-2014 05:29 AM


Originally Posted by badflaps (Post 1590138)
Useless information is stuff that hasn't happened to you..............yet.

Exactly my point.

tsquare 02-26-2014 05:31 AM


Originally Posted by CanoePilot (Post 1590134)
I really fail to see how drawing out and memorizing the electrical schematic has any practicality.


Of course you do. What practicality does landing in the first third of the runway have either, after all at JFK you have over 10,000 on just about every one. You NEVER use all of it, right? Just float and be sure you get that greaser...... you'll be fine.


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 04:17 AM.


User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.3.0 (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2024 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Website Copyright ©2000 - 2017 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands