Hawaiian Hiring FOs
01-24-2025 | 08:59 AM
#801
On Reserve
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 140
Likes: 5
1. That covers retirements and resignations.
2. That's code for an Alaskan 737 (maybe an old 700 series, maybe a max 7 if it ever gets certified). It certainly won't be another type for cost effectiveness. GTFs only make sense for savings on long routes- not interisland
3. Unitl WN stops flying early in the morning to HNL overnights stay
4. Well obviously. If you order a Boeing or an Airbus its a 7 year plus backlog.
5. Need to use what they have more effectively.
WB from Hawaii to west coast is not effective. The neo I fly now burns 5200 lbs per hour and has about 200 people. The 332 I flew at HAL burns 12-13000 lbs per hour and carries 279 with more cargo that may or may not make up the difference of 26000 lbs vs 60-70000 lbs of fuel.
6. Of course not. They have an entire seniority list of AS pilots that live in SEA and would give up a lot to get WB planes and pay rates at home. That will get ironed out in whatever contract and SLI they force HAL pilots into.
Just insights from a guy that left to legacy keeping tabs on if it was the right decision to leave- guess I will know in about 35 years
2. That's code for an Alaskan 737 (maybe an old 700 series, maybe a max 7 if it ever gets certified). It certainly won't be another type for cost effectiveness. GTFs only make sense for savings on long routes- not interisland
3. Unitl WN stops flying early in the morning to HNL overnights stay
4. Well obviously. If you order a Boeing or an Airbus its a 7 year plus backlog.
5. Need to use what they have more effectively.
WB from Hawaii to west coast is not effective. The neo I fly now burns 5200 lbs per hour and has about 200 people. The 332 I flew at HAL burns 12-13000 lbs per hour and carries 279 with more cargo that may or may not make up the difference of 26000 lbs vs 60-70000 lbs of fuel.
6. Of course not. They have an entire seniority list of AS pilots that live in SEA and would give up a lot to get WB planes and pay rates at home. That will get ironed out in whatever contract and SLI they force HAL pilots into.
Just insights from a guy that left to legacy keeping tabs on if it was the right decision to leave- guess I will know in about 35 years
I'm in love with Hawaii (and easy access to Korea) so I am gonna ride it out and see what happens lol. *gulp*
01-24-2025 | 10:04 AM
#802
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Joined: Apr 2023
Posts: 220
Likes: 61
Probably 10 more years until I see that again.
01-24-2025 | 12:31 PM
#803
On Reserve
Joined: Sep 2021
Posts: 158
Likes: 122
From the town hall yesterday
1. Expecting 50 new hires for the rest of the year
2. 717 replacement will not be regional jet - will be flown by mainline jet (still loooking for suitable candidates) 3-5 years left on 717 usage (again lol).
3. Inter island overnights are staying for now.
4. Airbuses are here to stay.
5. Widebody fleet & routes will likely grow in the future. Alaska wants international expansion.
6. No plans for Seattle base for Hawaiian pilots.
7. "Hawaiian" Callsign uncertain. (prob gonna go away)
So far - I'm liking what I'm hearing
.... except #7
1. Expecting 50 new hires for the rest of the year
2. 717 replacement will not be regional jet - will be flown by mainline jet (still loooking for suitable candidates) 3-5 years left on 717 usage (again lol).
3. Inter island overnights are staying for now.
4. Airbuses are here to stay.
5. Widebody fleet & routes will likely grow in the future. Alaska wants international expansion.
6. No plans for Seattle base for Hawaiian pilots.
7. "Hawaiian" Callsign uncertain. (prob gonna go away)
So far - I'm liking what I'm hearing
.... except #7The 330 also likely has more route cuts coming to Hawaii. Just about none of the international routes have good load factors, they can probably make a lot more money basing it out of Seattle and flying the international routes that they want to out of there.
01-24-2025 | 01:27 PM
#804
Line Holder
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 308
Likes: 4
From: Cessna 205
1. That covers retirements and resignations.
2. That's code for an Alaskan 737 (maybe an old 700 series, maybe a max 7 if it ever gets certified). It certainly won't be another type for cost effectiveness. GTFs only make sense for savings on long routes- not interisland
3. Unitl WN stops flying early in the morning to HNL overnights stay
4. Well obviously. If you order a Boeing or an Airbus its a 7 year plus backlog.
5. Need to use what they have more effectively.
WB from Hawaii to west coast is not effective. The neo I fly now burns 5200 lbs per hour and has about 200 people. The 332 I flew at HAL burns 12-13000 lbs per hour and carries 279 with more cargo that may or may not make up the difference of 26000 lbs vs 60-70000 lbs of fuel.
6. Of course not. They have an entire seniority list of AS pilots that live in SEA and would give up a lot to get WB planes and pay rates at home. That will get ironed out in whatever contract and SLI they force HAL pilots into.
Just insights from a guy that left to legacy keeping tabs on if it was the right decision to leave- guess I will know in about 35 years
2. That's code for an Alaskan 737 (maybe an old 700 series, maybe a max 7 if it ever gets certified). It certainly won't be another type for cost effectiveness. GTFs only make sense for savings on long routes- not interisland
3. Unitl WN stops flying early in the morning to HNL overnights stay
4. Well obviously. If you order a Boeing or an Airbus its a 7 year plus backlog.
5. Need to use what they have more effectively.
WB from Hawaii to west coast is not effective. The neo I fly now burns 5200 lbs per hour and has about 200 people. The 332 I flew at HAL burns 12-13000 lbs per hour and carries 279 with more cargo that may or may not make up the difference of 26000 lbs vs 60-70000 lbs of fuel.
6. Of course not. They have an entire seniority list of AS pilots that live in SEA and would give up a lot to get WB planes and pay rates at home. That will get ironed out in whatever contract and SLI they force HAL pilots into.
Just insights from a guy that left to legacy keeping tabs on if it was the right decision to leave- guess I will know in about 35 years
Also on the investor earnings call during the Q and A they quietly mentioned that the international routes out of SEA that are launching this summer will initially be flown on the 330.
01-24-2025 | 02:36 PM
#805
On Reserve
Joined: Jan 2025
Posts: 25
Likes: 6
Also, we won't be competing with Alaska pilots in the likely event that there is a fence (for at least some length of time).
01-25-2025 | 06:29 AM
#806
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Joined: Apr 2023
Posts: 220
Likes: 61
It's going to have switch relatively quickly for AS not to lose money on the international routes out of SEA. Next gen delta planes 359/339 get average of 25% CASM and have much better premium product. I think the cabin refresh on the 332s will happen faster than they can get enough 787s at the current productiom rate of 5.5 per month- and that rate is not improving no matter what the airline CEOs say.
If current politics get fuel prices lower that would be great for AS as fuel costs won't be so much of a cost when competing against a more fuel efficient plane. I really think they need a SEA-HND slot and better/more premium before big D thinks they are competition. My opinion is AS premium buyers are just going to use OneWolrld and fly JAL to HND
01-25-2025 | 07:24 AM
#807
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 44,841
Likes: 652
From: Engines Turn or People Swim
If current politics get fuel prices lower that would be great for AS as fuel costs won't be so much of a cost when competing against a more fuel efficient plane. I really think they need a SEA-HND slot and better/more premium before big D thinks they are competition. My opinion is AS premium buyers are just going to use OneWolrld and fly JAL to HND
They really rely more on a strong base of upper middle tier customers who are very loyal, and that loyalty is facilitated by upgrade opportunities. A full 1C section is probably mostly mileage plan upgrades.
I'd hazard that most of the true high rollers were already flying DAL anyway, at least the ones who's private jet doesn't have oceanic legs.
That's been the history anyway.
01-25-2025 | 07:35 AM
#808
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,705
Likes: 43
You want more branded credit card holders. Premium seats and destinations help build that.
Big D made nearly 2 billion on theirs in the second quarter alone last year.
Had heard that HA's take on their card was 1% on all purchases.
Big D made nearly 2 billion on theirs in the second quarter alone last year.
Had heard that HA's take on their card was 1% on all purchases.
01-25-2025 | 09:23 AM
#809
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 44,841
Likes: 652
From: Engines Turn or People Swim
And of course things can change.
I think one of the factors in pulling the trigger on international (via M&A) was the fact that One World doesn't actually work out great for AS's loyal customers. I've seen it myself, the one world partners tend to reserve their direct seats for themselves to sell at a premium... try to use points for international and it will route you all over the map on 2-3 airlines on three legs, basically on whatever seats are most likely to go empty anyway. Turns an 11 hour direct flight into a 30+ hour "adventure". Even though the "partner" is selling available seats on the direct flight.
01-25-2025 | 12:02 PM
#810
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 308
Likes: 4
From: Cessna 205
AS has never been that big on true premium customers.
They really rely more on a strong base of upper middle tier customers who are very loyal, and that loyalty is facilitated by upgrade opportunities. A full 1C section is probably mostly mileage plan upgrades.
I'd hazard that most of the true high rollers were already flying DAL anyway, at least the ones who's private jet doesn't have oceanic legs.
That's been the history anyway.
They really rely more on a strong base of upper middle tier customers who are very loyal, and that loyalty is facilitated by upgrade opportunities. A full 1C section is probably mostly mileage plan upgrades.
I'd hazard that most of the true high rollers were already flying DAL anyway, at least the ones who's private jet doesn't have oceanic legs.
That's been the history anyway.
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