Stinger6

Why does he hate it?

A while ago I got excoriated for opining that Horizon pilots, like most employees everywhere, lack perspective. Of course they exploit you (us). We are labor. Most corporations, whether publicly traded or privately held, will exploit labor. While some do it with more vigor than others, this is the nature or our quid-pro-quo: I take your screwing in exchange for your money and benefits. And this is the top reason why I hesitate to abandon my training now...the only thing different between airlines is usually the color of the paint. End of review lesson.

(I think that kerfuffle may have been on the Alaska boards)

I DID get contacted yesterday by training scheduling, on an actual OFF scheduled day, also a holiday (nbd if you're flying...but I'm holding a frosty beverage) after noon: "Can you show at 0830 tomorrow?" Ummm, also an OFF scheduled day and let me check Fly real quick...3 remaining flights (AS metal), all oversold, with double-digit non-revs listed. THIS is my big chance to get back in the sim? "Any chance I could get a little more notice than that?" "No."

Question remains: why does he hate it? Hours? Lines? QOL? Pay? Upgrade opportunity? Airplane (I already hate the airplane)? All of the above?

fivebyfive

All of the above. And as for the “elephant in the room”, the plane is a piece of sh**. Ya, it goes into wild and exotic places and has a hud. But I would give both of those away for some intuitive rudder/yaw trim. Instead of sweating in the Q this summer, you could be watching snow come out of your vent in the jet. Just sayin’.

Stinger6

Love it.
"Yaw Damper Light?"
"Illuminated."
"Yaw Damper?"
"Not installed."

Sikorsky38

Accountants at AAG are dictating how much effort and cost will be spent on new hires. Every manager I ask, tells me the same thing, that they are having no problem staffing the Q400. I believe that the only reason this is a fact, is that within a period of 30 months, they are ridding themselves of 23 Q400s. If they had to staff all of our original number of Q400s (53), they would not be able to treat QX new hires as just a number, but so many are answering the recruiters’ pitch, that they can afford to washout a high number of new hires. They are having to take much lower experience level pilots these days. They are still getting proficient military and civilian pilots and they are getting through, but there are not enough of them to meet the needed numbers for the openings on the line. To make up the difference, they are taking very low experience pilots and providing just enough training to where enough get through to make up the difference the company needs. Our union guys are sitting in on a very high number of Training Review Boards. New hires do not get any special consideration for trying hard or for example, having 43 days off with no sim training after a first ‘Maneuvers Validation’ failure.

A new hire at QX gets no ‘new hire bonus’ at least until completing initial operating experience, and getting a failure during training is a significant risk and detrimental to your future career. With all of the recent hundreds of new hires during the past year, I have to assume the company has a lot of numbers through which to sift that tells them when to draw the line on extra training. A year ago, many new hires were getting lots of extra chances. Lately, the company has really been tightening up on their dispensing of additional training. As others have said, if you are low on proficiency and or time, enter the Q400 program at your own risk.

afcraig2010

New hire Q400 FO starting tomorrow. Figured I’d chime in with a bit of intel: my class will be the first through a new footprint and the ground school looks like it went from 10 days to a month. I think I saw 13 sim sessions somewhere as well.

cactusflyer

Ironically, that's almost identical to what the training footprint was when I was hired in early 2014, although I think the ground school was only 3 weeks then.

Since that point, QX has tried cutting out various portions of the training to try and cut costs, but since it's always managed to backfire somehow, they've apparently realized that "give new-hires enough training" actually works pretty well.

Griever

That was the original training regime. It included a week of indoc/FOM which brought it to four weeks.

We can probably thank FAA for this change. Just my opinion.

Fixnem2Flyinem

As for the sim training on the Q400, it really isn’t that hard if you put in the study time outside of the sim. They give you the whole syllabus on the IPad and brief the following lesson during your debrief every day. Take that time to learn every detail on the SID’s, approach plates and profiles you will be flying the next lesson.

Trust me, if I made it through with no extra time anyone who has a commercial multi can. It’s all about attitude and knowing what to study. 90% of the time the auto pilot is on anyway, it’s not a time for you to get a feel for the plane. That is what IOE is for, use the autopilot and stay ahead of the plane, that will be 1000% easier if you put the studying in. Flows are somewhat involved, so have those down cold prior to sim. Be able to do them with little thought which again is repitition and studying.

BigfatQ

Yeah you will be doing 90% of your pm flows from the left seat because the other FO is flying right seat, so practice them both ways

Jeff4912

Speaking of flows, any chance that we new hires can get them prior to class starting?
Are they self explanatory or does an instructor need to demonstrate them before you get the flows to practice?