Tell us something we don't know.

This is why we voted in a union and are getting ready for a labor dispute.

 

Or the one he's with currently--B6

 

The fact that these 2 airlines are mentioned in the same paragraph speaks for itself- No argument needed.
B6 is 3/4 of a major or, if you like PP, a great regional airline. Obviously, thats on the present $hitbox contract. A new CBA in 18 months will be a vast improvement though.
Bpf is gonna love your check in the meantime.

 

Again as the other guy said it's a cyclical industry. We can get into this over and over. When I was hired in 2004 at AWAC....CAL would not cover your first 6 months of insurance. It's not till recently that the majors have fixed first year pay. Again you don't see me defending our first year pay. Now if we want to get into it I can make the argument that you me and ATR seemed to be just fine with first year pay since we all willingly took the job here. That does not excuse the fact of we are where we are but these rates are public knowledge. Should we compare ourselves to a regional NO but at the same time ALK first year is 57 HAL 36 UPS 46. Is that OK and how did 9e pass them? I know you will say well it's just first year and they have a contract so you will be better off. I agree, and I think in the long run we will be the same.

We are doing massive work here. Building a union and a CBA from scratch, changing the way JetBlue as a company deals with pilots and changing the very "culture" of JetBlue.

This is a foundational contract and every future CBA here will be built on this. I want it done but I also want it done right. So this debate is slightly pointless. ATR was able to take a shot( I didnt argue that his pay issue was wrong) just that there is a lot to this debate.

Again not attack you in anyway. I just think if people want real debates you need to look at everything and how we are where we are. There are so many different parts that need to be taken into context.

I agree we are a regional airline with our route map, I also agree we will be much better off when we have a contract. The 18 month part I'm not so sure about

 

To be fair, there are plenty of pilots here who would not agree with you or me that we are extremely underpaid and that we deserve a contract on par with our peers.

 

I disagree with this. I think most understand exactly where we are, and where we are going. We voted in ALPA, and we are negotiating a CBA. It’s very disingenuous to say “LOOK at how underpaid we are!” as if the rest of the industry has always been SO far ahead, and we aren’t doing anything to fix it. The starting pay at all of the major airlines has only recently jumped. Some were in the $35 range not that long ago. We are working to close the gap that has recently appeared.

I think where people disagree centers around:

1. How miserable it is here (your opinion)
2. The timeline for our negotiations is too slow (your opinion)
3. That we should all be trying to leave. (Some of us want to stay and improve the place, and we aren’t miserable.)
4. That we should be discouraging people from coming here, because, my god, it’s miserable here.

Look, I understand your position. You’re frustrated. Got it. But you shouldn’t be angry at the majority who are not of like mind.

 

There are dumb people all over the place.

But with the vote total, our membership numbers and the amount of guys going to the two rallies, I would say those that disagree with us are in the minority.

 

As a former 9E guy, my knee jerk reaction is "What's the catch?" Could just be the 7 years of a beatdown I took there between contract negotiations, a failed TA that would have hosed every junior guy on property, a double merger and a bankruptcy, though. I hear it's better there now, but I see that wage and I immediately wanna start digging into the contract language on the work rules to find the loopholes. Maybe it's better, though.

One thing you can't argue with is our NC should take that to the table (if it passes) and say "A REGIONAL airline is now paying their FOs the equivalent of what we're paying. How are we going to attract quality talent going forward if we can't even compete with that? Oh, and their healthcare is better." I don't know if it actually is, but come on? How could it be worse. It was certainly better when I was there compared to what we have now. I remember complaining when I had to pay a $200 deductible. What's an extra $1100 per family member?

The longer this drags out, the more of a nightmare summer 2018 is gonna be staffing wise. And I'm not sure "It's ATC's fault" is going to work again two summers in a row.....

 

Didn't work this year. We were late today! ATC didn't fuel us until almost departure time....

 

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