P-3Bubba

No, I’m with you Driver. The ADG is a good part of the CBA. I cant count the times I’ve been driving home (pre-CBA) at 0300 and saying “boy I just worked an extra day for free”. But, with the ADG the company optimized pairings to make the ADG less of a possible expense, and in doing so they crushed some QOL.

What exacerbates the optimizer/QOL problem is the fact the company knew and relies upon the pilots extending and working into fatigue windows for our culture. It’s pretty daunting when the station manager and 100 customers stare at you as you encroach upon 13 hours of duty and beg you to fly the last leg of a day into the red-eye window when you started the day 3 legs earlier and at 1pm.

-Bubs

Flightcap

OAL guy just wandering through here. Mass cancellations and fatigue reports related to pairing construction have been pretty effective at getting certain pairings changed at Spirit. The company doesn't like when the same flight cancels multiple days a week for the same reason. Especially not when those 100 passengers hear "tell the company to change how they build our schedules because after working 11 hours already today I am exhausted and it would not be safe for me to take you flying."

Bluedriver

Agreed ....

disenchantMINT

You are 100% correct. One might argue certain pilot groups have more spinal fortitude than others, however. It's a sad reality.

hyperboy

One might also argue that plenty of pilots here should stop posting here, immediately join an ALPA committee and be part of the solution while having the spinal fortitude to realize that complaining anonymously on this board will do little for the pilot group or themselves............It's a sad reality.

Bluedriver

Long time Hyper.

While quiet behind-the-scenes committee work is extremely important, there is also a compelling argument to open discussion with "the masses" (even if only a portion of them) to change the hearts and minds of the low-worth just-happy-to-be-LCC pilots crowd.

Just another perspective.

disenchantMINT

What the hell does joining an ALPA committee have to do with calling fatigued during a fatiguing pairing instead of just toughing it out because you're so brainwashed by the Blue Cult?

hyperboy

You should NEVER fly if you are fatigued.....Now show me where i Said otherwise......Way to distract with your "fake news"

360KIAS

Deflection, deflection, JB sucks, and you're a loser if you don't agree. Same channel, same show now for several years.

disenchantMINT

I'll hold your hand and help you along this logical journey.

I agreed with an OAL guy that calling fatigued was the only way to fix systemically fatiguing pairings, while noting that some pilot groups as a whole (e.g., Spirit) are not afflicted by the cult-inspired brainwashing that inspires the actions (and posts on this very thread) of many pilots at a certain other carrier.

You responded to my statement (that people should call fatigued instead of drinking the juice and completing the mission), with a statement that those who have a problem with fatiguing pairings should stop complaining and "join an ALPA committee."

I asked what joining a committee had to do with a line pilot calling out fatigued for a fatiguing pairings, to which you and 360 (a reliable management booster like yourself) suggest I'm deflecting and distracting which is -- I'd say ironically, but it's not anymore -- exactly what you did.

We could learn a lot from the Spirit pilot group, but unfortunately there are too many here who choose to hold us back by attacking those with legitimate concerns and complaints.