First, Sky.... few here consider YOU one of US anymore.... second... your entire diatribe of these last few posts revolves around around making huge amounts of money... and you allude to the fact that if simply you could make that kind of money flying you would do so... that makes you a *****... plain and simple.

 

And lets be honest. Sure airline pilots could be paid more and have lost alot of ground. But, compared to many other jobs the top tier aviation jobs sure beat pounding the pavement in government work.

Besides, I don't think there are any fields right now that haven't taken a hit. Whether US postal, LEO's or firefighters almost every governmental agency has taken furloughs or paycuts. Not to mention layoffs. It's not only aviation that has taken a dive, especially recently.

Besides, I don't think that the recent people going into aviation expect to be millionaires. Lets give credit to some of the younger folk. Thanks to the internet they may have a better and realistic view of what a life in aviation is like. Still many may just want to fly for a living and make a decent paycheck. Nothing wrong with that. The past is the past, the sooner people realize that they aren't going to be winning the lotto as a senior captain somewhere they won't be disappointed in their career choice. Realistic expectations...

 

Hi Rnav,

"Still many may just want to fly for a living and make a decent paycheck. Nothing wrong with that. The past is the past, the sooner people realize that they aren't going to be winning the lotto as a senior captain somewhere they won't be disappointed in their career choice. Realistic expectations..."

Do you think this is reality though? Can people have a decent life (schedule, salary) outside of the mid to higher seniority levels of the 'legacies'? Do these kids realize that? Are people looking to profit from their dreams going to tell them the not-so-great part? Will the vast majority of these "kids" listen to the downside as well as the upside and factor both in the equation? This is aviation we're talking about. The siren song of the sleek jet is too great to ignore.

I'm all for realistic expectations but, is that what we're dealing with in aviation?

 

Never has been, never will be. If you get into aviation with one singular all consuming legacy goal, chances are you're going to be disappointed.

 

And some never grasp that not everyone wants to be a legacy captain and that aviation, as an industry, can hold many different goals which are attainable.

USMCFLYR

 

Absolutely true.

Most of the guys who I knew in the early days who got into flying simply because they wanted the lifestyle and the money of a major airline captain are long gone.

Those were the guys who didn't know the difference between a C-172 and 747 when they started flying they just thought they were going to make a lot of money as a big jet pilot. On the other hand the guys who got into it because they loved airplanes and flying generally are still in the business in one capacity or another and are generally satisfied.

If you get into this thinking that you are going to scream up the ranks and land at a major, with a time frame in mind there is most likely a big dose of bitter disillusionment waiting for you somewhere along the path.

I am one of those who never pictured myself at a major and I refused to work for any regional, ever. I never had illusions of a preordained self imposed career path on a time line. I did what I wanted, enjoyed what I was doing at the time, progressed when I had a chance and didn't worry about things I couldn't change.

 

Nice post hoss (little joe would be proud). On a side note, it sounds like Rnav is management.

 

Yes Rnav sounds like management...

 

Besides, I don't think that the recent people going into aviation expect to be millionaires. Lets give credit to some of the younger folk. Thanks to the internet they may have a better and realistic view of what a life in aviation is like. Still many may just want to fly for a living and make a decent paycheck. Nothing wrong with that. The past is the past, the sooner people realize that they aren't going to be winning the lotto as a senior captain somewhere they won't be disappointed in their career choice. Realistic expectations...[/QUOTE]

Trying to rationalize what has been lost is exactly why pay and QOL continue to degrade. Management types are tripping all over themselves trying to find people with this passive mentality. I would argue that most young people that are now entering aviation are more naive than their predecessors. Return on investment to be a pilot is an absolute joke. Unless daddy is cover all cost, the only reasonable strategy is to apply to the Air Guard.

In regard to the much anticipated pilot shortage...even the most ardent optimist must look at the following:

-retirement attrition doesn't fully develop at most carriers until 2017.

-The world economy is on the verge of another financial collapse that will
rival 2008.(no international growth)

-Delta is reducing capacity. Other carriers will probably
follow.(no domestic growth)

-The mass exodus of highly qualified military pilots ready to leave at the
first opportunity.

-The majority of regional captains are becoming lifers, leaving fewer
upgrade opportunities in the short-term. (longer upgrades)

-Having to overcome nepotism, minority preference, and flow-throughs.

 

Listen folks I'm not management. That was actually funny. I wish I was management, I'd be rich. But I'll play management for a second. From a management point of view there will be no pilot shortage. Thanks to our lobbyist and legislation all this talk about pilot shortage will never materialize. Now enjoy your new reality you gear-monkeys! JK.

Serious, my post was more directed to the incessant beat down of the industry. The industry is screwed up big time. But there are people that are happy flying for a living. We can't say EVERYONE hates/has a bad experience in aviation. I'm not going to knock my friends who enjoy their profession. Its about balance.