attendance/reliability program
02-10-2019, 11:07 AM
#1
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Joined APC: May 2017
Posts: 39
attendance/reliability program
Good Afternoon,
I hope it is not too strange to ask this question....I am now applying to regional airlines and what surprises me the most about the process is the attendance/reliability program in place at most regionals. You can pretty much expect to get a phone call after 4 sick calls a year any place you go.
A look through the forum paints a pretty grim picture going all the way up to the major and legacy (some improvement of course but still not ideal.) 7 calls will get you noticed at Fedex, 5 at Jetblue, it seems that at Delta you may be expected to disclose the nature of your illness which goes beyond just a doctor's note. Surprisingly whether the sick call is legit or not does not make a difference. Whether you have hours in your sick bank or not does not matter.
Coming from 135, I totally understand that there is no operation that is 100% legal but I am not the kind of person who condone doing things that are unsafe. I do everything in my power to be safe, to the point where I have backed out of some 135 job offers due to what I find out about maintenance or about being required to be on call 24/7 (rolling rest).
I understand that sick calls are not meant for schedule adjustment and I personally have never called in sick if I am not sick. However, you can't always control if and when you get sick especially if you spend many hours a day stuck in a metal tube with a whole bunch of people. The worst thing is when you get a killer sinus infection that could pretty much ground you for 2 months. These attendance program , in my opinion, may as well be renamed "pilot pushing" program. The stick is there waiting to smack you if you are out sick too often, regardless of the fact that we really should not fly sick . The union reps I have spoken to said these policies are not really enforceable, but to me being flagged for sick calls will land you on the radar which is not a good thing.
which is why I am here to ask you...what's the sick call policy like at your company? It will at least help me see if things are actually going to be better once I get to major/legacy, and help me find out who to target. In the meantime I can only hope I don't get sick too often at the regional and end up with disciplinary actions, making me even less hireable.
This post is not meant to be negative. Flying is awesome, and I could go on and on about that. I am just trying to resolve this issue and figure out how to go forward. I appreciate your input
Thanks!
I hope it is not too strange to ask this question....I am now applying to regional airlines and what surprises me the most about the process is the attendance/reliability program in place at most regionals. You can pretty much expect to get a phone call after 4 sick calls a year any place you go.
A look through the forum paints a pretty grim picture going all the way up to the major and legacy (some improvement of course but still not ideal.) 7 calls will get you noticed at Fedex, 5 at Jetblue, it seems that at Delta you may be expected to disclose the nature of your illness which goes beyond just a doctor's note. Surprisingly whether the sick call is legit or not does not make a difference. Whether you have hours in your sick bank or not does not matter.
Coming from 135, I totally understand that there is no operation that is 100% legal but I am not the kind of person who condone doing things that are unsafe. I do everything in my power to be safe, to the point where I have backed out of some 135 job offers due to what I find out about maintenance or about being required to be on call 24/7 (rolling rest).
I understand that sick calls are not meant for schedule adjustment and I personally have never called in sick if I am not sick. However, you can't always control if and when you get sick especially if you spend many hours a day stuck in a metal tube with a whole bunch of people. The worst thing is when you get a killer sinus infection that could pretty much ground you for 2 months. These attendance program , in my opinion, may as well be renamed "pilot pushing" program. The stick is there waiting to smack you if you are out sick too often, regardless of the fact that we really should not fly sick . The union reps I have spoken to said these policies are not really enforceable, but to me being flagged for sick calls will land you on the radar which is not a good thing.
which is why I am here to ask you...what's the sick call policy like at your company? It will at least help me see if things are actually going to be better once I get to major/legacy, and help me find out who to target. In the meantime I can only hope I don't get sick too often at the regional and end up with disciplinary actions, making me even less hireable.
This post is not meant to be negative. Flying is awesome, and I could go on and on about that. I am just trying to resolve this issue and figure out how to go forward. I appreciate your input
Thanks!
02-10-2019, 12:00 PM
#3
Layover Master
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Position: Seated
Posts: 4,310
I won’t go into details or name airlines but I have seen an airline bring pilots in for discipline hearings at six sick calls in a rolling year regardless of the nature. They were guilty until proven innocent in the hearings and suspensions weren’t terribly uncommon. This was 121 union shop.
I’ve also seen an airline demand doctor notes on any major holiday or the Super Bowl, failure to comply resulted in disciplinary hearings. Further, this airline sent out threatening letters before holidays reminding pilots that it was their own fault for these unfortunate policies.
I’ve also seen an airline demand doctor notes on any major holiday or the Super Bowl, failure to comply resulted in disciplinary hearings. Further, this airline sent out threatening letters before holidays reminding pilots that it was their own fault for these unfortunate policies.
02-10-2019, 12:01 PM
#4
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Joined APC: May 2017
Posts: 39
Originally Posted by Skyward
No (official) policy that I know of at SWA. If you’re sick, you’re sick. Sick time accrues at 10% of your credit for the month (i.e., get paid 100 then you accrue 10 sick)
Thanks. I am a coming (in a couple years that is)
02-10-2019, 12:02 PM
#5
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,735
We had these same attendance policy at Endeavor while I was there. Once you get to the majors, it’s a different story. When I went to the Spirit job fair, one of the questions I was asked was how many sick calls have I had in the last 12 months. I told them I had 5 calls, and they didn’t seem to care. I have no idea why they have those policies at the regionals. It use to be so bad at Pinnacle/Endeavor that we would get a memo to bring in a doctor’a note, if we call in sick that falls on any holiday, even Super Bowl or Halloween.
02-10-2019, 12:03 PM
#6
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Posts: 39
Originally Posted by PotatoChip
I won’t go into details or name airlines but I have seen an airline bring pilots in for discipline hearings at six sick calls in a rolling year regardless of the nature. They were guilty until proven innocent in the hearings and suspensions weren’t terribly uncommon. This was 121 union shop.
I’ve also seen an airline demand doctor notes on any major holiday or the Super Bowl, failure to comply resulted in disciplinary hearings. Further, this airline sent out threatening letters before holidays reminding pilots that it was their own fault for these unfortunate policies.
I’ve also seen an airline demand doctor notes on any major holiday or the Super Bowl, failure to comply resulted in disciplinary hearings. Further, this airline sent out threatening letters before holidays reminding pilots that it was their own fault for these unfortunate policies.
Hey, wish I knew who this was so I know to stay away.
Demanding notes on major holiday and the Super Bowl is understandable. However, a disciplinary for six sick calls regardless of whether they are legit is not acceptable...in my book anyways (as if it matters.....ain't a CEO lol)
For the record, I have never called in sick for the Super Bowl lol.
02-10-2019, 12:07 PM
#7
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Joined APC: May 2017
Posts: 39
Originally Posted by Silver02ex
We had these same attendance policy at Endeavor while I was there. Once you get to the majors, it’s a different story. When I went to the Spirit job fair, one of the questions I was asked was how many sick calls have I had in the last 12 months. I told them I had 5 calls, and they didn’t seem to care. I have no idea why they have those policies at the regionals. It use to be so bad at Pinnacle/Endeavor that we would get a memo to bring in a doctor’a note, if we call in sick that falls on any holiday, even Super Bowl or Halloween.
See I really don't mind the notes. If I am sick I always go to the doctor and always get a note just in case. What I mind is when they say the call counts as an occurrence regardless of nature and you start getting phone calls from management and/ or disciplinary hearing once you accrue so many occurrences/points and warning letters are placed in your file.
02-10-2019, 12:13 PM
#8
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2017
Position: 737 FO
Posts: 947
Originally Posted by flyinghedgehog
See I really don't mind the notes. If I am sick I always go to the doctor and always get a note just in case. What I mind is when they say the call counts as an occurrence regardless of nature and you start getting phone calls from management and/ or disciplinary hearing once you accrue so many occurrences/points and warning letters are placed in your file.
I'm not reimbursed for my time to go to the doctor, my deductible or co-pay isn't covered under this policy, and frankly, it's none of anyone's business why I wasn't well enough to sign a release. I have enough experience to know when I'm fit to fly and when I am not. Not every time that I am unfit to fly requires me to go to a germ factory doctor's office just so she can tell me to drink more fluids and get some more rest.
Sick call is an earned benefit governed by each union's CBA. Removing language like that which requires doctor's notes or any kind of disciplinary action for x number of calls is something for the union to aim for while times are good and to hold the line on when they ain't so good.
02-10-2019, 12:20 PM
#9
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Originally Posted by Zard
I very much mind a doctor's note policy.
I'm not reimbursed for my time to go to the doctor, my deductible or co-pay isn't covered under this policy, and frankly, it's none of anyone's business why I wasn't well enough to sign a release. I have enough experience to know when I'm fit to fly and when I am not. Not every time that I am unfit to fly requires me to go to a germ factory doctor's office just so she can tell me to drink more fluids and get some more rest.
Sick call is an earned benefit governed by each union's CBA. Removing language like that which requires doctor's notes or any kind of disciplinary action for x number of calls is something for the union to aim for while times are good and to hold the line on when they ain't so good.
I'm not reimbursed for my time to go to the doctor, my deductible or co-pay isn't covered under this policy, and frankly, it's none of anyone's business why I wasn't well enough to sign a release. I have enough experience to know when I'm fit to fly and when I am not. Not every time that I am unfit to fly requires me to go to a germ factory doctor's office just so she can tell me to drink more fluids and get some more rest.
Sick call is an earned benefit governed by each union's CBA. Removing language like that which requires doctor's notes or any kind of disciplinary action for x number of calls is something for the union to aim for while times are good and to hold the line on when they ain't so good.
What I find is those "Attendance/Reliability" programs are found in FOM or Employee Handbook and not CBA. Does that make it even less likely for them to enforce it?
I don't necessarily agree with the language either and would say that in a perfect world a note would not be required. I agree that there are days one would not be fit to sign a release but could not be classified as sick either, but so far that has not happened to me. Luckily for me as well, I am different from most people when it comes to going to the doctor. I would go see them nonetheless just to make sure it is not strep throat or something that would require medication.
02-10-2019, 12:22 PM
#10
Layover Master
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Position: Seated
Posts: 4,310
Doctor’s notes should upset you. I’m a professional paid to make serious decisions on a daily basis, but I’m not trusted to tell if I have a cold?
I’m not reimbursed for my time to go the doctor. If I have allergies that are blocking my sinuses and preventing me to fly, I don’t need a doctor to tell me to take Allegra. Further, that doctor visit I don’t need is going to cost me about $100-$150 out of my HSA. Company going to reimburse me for that??
Someone calls in sick for Christmas, than the Super Bowl, than Fourth of July... okay, that’s a pattern.
I’m not reimbursed for my time to go the doctor. If I have allergies that are blocking my sinuses and preventing me to fly, I don’t need a doctor to tell me to take Allegra. Further, that doctor visit I don’t need is going to cost me about $100-$150 out of my HSA. Company going to reimburse me for that??
Someone calls in sick for Christmas, than the Super Bowl, than Fourth of July... okay, that’s a pattern.
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