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Margaritaville 09-20-2022 07:06 AM

What if I told you that the only reason the legacies are throwing all this money at the regionals is to kill the ULCCs by starving them of pilots?

rickair7777 09-20-2022 07:34 AM


Originally Posted by Margaritaville (Post 3497830)
What if I told you that the only reason the legacies are throwing all this money at the regionals is to kill the ULCCs by starving them of pilots?

That would actually be illegal if they said it out loud or put it in writing.

But I think it's a band-aid at best because anyone who isn't a Compleat Moroon knows the nature of the regional model, and it's prospects for long-term lucrative, stable employment. Just met 50-something new hire, he bailed after nearly 20 years at one of the more reputable regionals :eek:

I suspect they (legacies) might have a plan of some sort, but just need to time to implement it. Maybe I'm giving them too much credit.

Margaritaville 09-20-2022 08:30 AM


Originally Posted by rickair7777 (Post 3497844)
That would actually be illegal if they said it out loud or put it in writing.

But I think it's a band-aid at best because anyone who isn't a Compleat Moroon knows the nature of the regional model, and it's prospects for long-term lucrative, stable employment. Just met 50-something new hire, he bailed after nearly 20 years at one of the more reputable regionals :eek:

I suspect they (legacies) might have a plan of some sort, but just need to time to implement it. Maybe I'm giving them too much credit.

No doubt its also a band aid on the hemorrhaging of pilots but yeah someone would have to be a complete fool to pass up a legacy to stay at a regional, even with the high pay and bonuses. I think everyone knows it can't last and isn't falling for it. I don't believe legacy management is that stupid, plus they know it's going to give legacy pilots unreasonable expectations of what to expect in the contracts. Therefore there must be ulterior motives to make this cost out. People like me talk crap about management, but let's be honest, they play 4D chess most of the time while pilots play checkers looking through a straw.

nene 09-20-2022 08:39 AM


Originally Posted by Margaritaville (Post 3497830)
What if I told you that the only reason the legacies are throwing all this money at the regionals is to kill the ULCCs by starving them of pilots?

It seems more likely that some legacy networks are very reliant on the RJ model and can't change fast enough to upguage or lose domestic share. They need the RJ's to function a little longer until mainline can adjust and/or the economy dries up the sudden demand for pilots.

rickair7777 09-20-2022 12:53 PM


Originally Posted by Margaritaville (Post 3497895)
No doubt its also a band aid on the hemorrhaging of pilots but yeah someone would have to be a complete fool to pass up a legacy to stay at a regional, even with the high pay and bonuses.

I think it will make a difference for those over 50 who live in base and have lots of seniority. Those are also the core of the instructor cadre, 20-year guys leaving the regionals was going to kill them off faster than anything else. I would have thought long and hard.


Originally Posted by Margaritaville (Post 3497895)
I think everyone knows it can't last and isn't falling for it. I don't believe legacy management is that stupid, plus they know it's going to give legacy pilots unreasonable expectations of what to expect in the contracts. Therefore there must be ulterior motives to make this cost out. People like me talk crap about management, but let's be honest, they play 4D chess most of the time while pilots play checkers looking through a straw.

They play chess with contracts. But I don't think they really believed in Pilot Shortage until it happened, at which point it was too late. I think they got caught with their pants down. The top managers are scrambling to avoid catastrophic operational meltdowns, because enough of that will get them fired. I assume they are planning ahead, but I don't think they're executing on that yet, they're just reacting.

In fairness covid was a distraction, and they initially though they'd need to furlough 40% and hunker down for ten years.

Vectors4 09-23-2022 03:18 PM


Originally Posted by flyprdu (Post 3493773)
Alaska is reportedly very close.

Whether or not it moves the needle remains to be seen.


Alaska TA just released...

sailingfun 09-23-2022 03:54 PM


Originally Posted by Vectors4 (Post 3500033)
Alaska TA just released...

Looks like it more or less gets them up to where we are now. Certainly no help for our contract.

tailendcharlie 09-23-2022 06:06 PM


Originally Posted by Margaritaville (Post 3497830)
What if I told you that the only reason the legacies are throwing all this money at the regionals is to kill the ULCCs by starving them of pilots?

Well it’s working for one ULCC who can’t get anyone to show up & is cancelling new-hire classes & is on the verge of imploding….

bonvoyage 09-23-2022 07:01 PM


Originally Posted by tailendcharlie (Post 3500185)
Well it’s working for one ULCC who can’t get anyone to show up & is cancelling new-hire classes & is on the verge of imploding….

Allegiant? Breeze? Spirit? Spill the beans, c’mon

Aero1900 09-23-2022 10:54 PM


Originally Posted by bonvoyage (Post 3500230)
Allegiant? Breeze? Spirit? Spill the beans, c’mon

Don't know, but (somewhat surprisingly) Frontier is filling big classes. 55+ new hires with 100% showing up


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