Are we sure about this? Why did they not want it a few years ago then? Why the sudden change now?

 

I think he means RJ companies.

 

If US went before ICAO, which was what almost happened a couple years ago, then there would be a lot of disruption...

They'd either have to retrain elders with two years left for fleets where they could bid domestic, or possibly just end up having to pay them WB CA pay to sit out the last two years, depending on CBA language, the language in the law, or maybe just the cost of re-training.

This was a US-only issue.

It's not apparent to me that there's been a change in the position of the US legacies

Regionals, ACMI, bizav were in favor of 67 all along. I think most foreign airlines are in favor, since most of them have perennial pilot shortages

But it's obvious that if ICAO goes first or at the same time then the only remaining downside for the legacies is possible increased absenteeism/LTD, and higher average longevity (more pay, vacay, etc) across the entire pilot group.

There's a possible upside in that they won't have to hire and train replacements quite as often, which is amplified at multi-fleet legacies where one old senior guy leaving triggers a cascade of training events. It's not just the cost of the training, it's also the cost of all those pilots getting paid for many months while not being productive.

 

Just wanted to add a +1 to the nepotism angle that he is schilling for his brother. That's relevant, IMO.


All airlines? I don't think it's obvious at all. Maybe for regional/LCC with high turnover. I'd argue it's the exact opposite for "forever job"/Legacy airlines. Training Center costs are mostly a sunk cost for Legacies, with small variable costs - they are not going to maintain any more or less sims based on 65 vs. 67. 64 year old pilots have 5 or 6 weeks of vacation and are top-of-scale, vs. a NH with maybe 2-weeks of vacation, and bottom-scale. Not to mention the potential of the chaos from the US raising the age before ICAO.

 

makes sense. Thanks

 

pretty sure most of the majors have come out against raising the age .. but sure

 

From a different pilot forum.


"too selfish to play by the rules"..."pulling up the ladder on those younger".....

Laughable, hypocritical BS. The "majority" here want the 65's to get out for one reason only: money and seniority. The exact same reason the ones who wish to stay have.

Not all of us age 64 are blessed with the thirty year, wide body captain career here. I would have started here in my late twenties or early thirties, but alas, I was too busy screwing around, serving my country and YOUR safety and security, and then toiling at the regional for 10 years, then another FOUR while furloughed immediately after hired here... thanks, ALPA, for the outsourcing, and the merger, BTW. This pilot group worked under bankruptcy contract conditions for years, finally out of that December of 2012. So a lot of us have only been able to really save for retirement since then.

Pilot retirement ages have always been about one thing only, Money. Not about health, safety, cognition, etc.

“It is pure age discrimination, if you are honest about it. and your self-righteous blathering about the "greedy" older pilots "screwing" you is your own version of self-interest and greed....

But whatever, moving on soon. Best wishes, hope the upcoming furlough from war, terrorism, resession, depression, merger, etc. doesn't bite YOU too hard, and you don't have to keep working until YOUR full social security retirement age.

 

Guess you should have done 20. Choices.

 

yep exactly.

Thought older people were all about accountability for ones actions and choices and the choices he made defined his career path with some unlucky breaks along the way. But it was his choice to join the military( certainly wasn't drafted), his choice to stay in as long as he did, etc. And because his choices led to his timing into this industry being bad, he is entitled to an age change where the first age change further screwed him?

But I still find his reasoning easier to accept than the 3rd divorcee and secret family in Buenos Aires 777 CA whining for the age change. I can at least empathize for the career the former military pilot had. No empathy for the 3rd time divorced captain, married to number 4 with a secret family in Buenos Aires having it tough and can't afford to retire.

 

He listed most of the reasons for why we should not raise the age. As for SS, many of the young newhires will be lucky if the SS they collect will be anything close to its current form.