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CVR Bill in Congress. NOT GOOD !!

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Old 11-21-2009 | 05:49 PM
  #51  
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nationwide strike would be epic awesome..... period.



and this just might be the thing to tie all the pilots together for a cause.
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Old 11-22-2009 | 01:28 AM
  #52  
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Originally Posted by HSLD
Random Drug and Alcohol testing and a voice recorder in chambers to "to evaluate or monitor the judgment or performance of an individual Senator" sounds like a good start.

I don't understand how the congress/senate is exempt from drug testing, something all other federal employees have to do.

I bet if there was an attempt to place recording devices in the cabs of locomotive engineers, it would never happen.
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Old 11-22-2009 | 03:33 AM
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Originally Posted by HSLD
Random Drug and Alcohol testing and a voice recorder in chambers to "to evaluate or monitor the judgment or performance of an individual Senator" sounds like a good start.

Wow, that's a great idea.
I don't ever see it happening though, mainly because it would probably find over half of our current elected officials in violation. Secondly, the people who write the rules will never write rules against themselves. I believe it is that sort of arrogance in our current political system that has so many hardworking American outraged. Essentially the American Government is infallible, while every other citizen is open to blame and criminalization.

Just look at pay and compensation, can you think of any other occupation where the employees vote and decide on their own pay raises with nothing but their own discretion? The people who set the rules of the game will always win, while the rest of the players lag in the distance.

Maybe every four years when we vote in new officials, we should also vote in on compensation rates for said officials. If we, as a pilot union, must gain approval from the people who sign our checks (management), then politicians should have to gain approval from the people who sign their checks (the American People). A performance-based salary system would also be a good way to have our government thinking about the well being of this nation, as opposed to eternally concentrating on re-election.

Rant over.
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Old 11-22-2009 | 06:00 AM
  #54  
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Originally Posted by DeadHead
Maybe every four years when we vote in new officials, we should also vote in on compensation rates for said officials.

Better yet, how about have them bid to do the job. Lowest bidder gets the job. It's not like we'd see a slip in quality of work coming out of Congress over what we have today.
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Old 11-22-2009 | 11:54 AM
  #55  
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Originally Posted by tortue
I don't understand how the congress/senate is exempt from drug testing, something all other federal employees have to do.

I bet if there was an attempt to place recording devices in the cabs of locomotive engineers, it would never happen.
Originally Posted by DeadHead
Wow, that's a great idea.
I don't ever see it happening though, mainly because it would probably find over half of our current elected officials in violation. Secondly, the people who write the rules will never write rules against themselves. I believe it is that sort of arrogance in our current political system that has so many hardworking American outraged. Essentially the American Government is infallible, while every other citizen is open to blame and criminalization.

Just look at pay and compensation, can you think of any other occupation where the employees vote and decide on their own pay raises with nothing but their own discretion? The people who set the rules of the game will always win, while the rest of the players lag in the distance.

Maybe every four years when we vote in new officials, we should also vote in on compensation rates for said officials. If we, as a pilot union, must gain approval from the people who sign our checks (management), then politicians should have to gain approval from the people who sign their checks (the American People). A performance-based salary system would also be a good way to have our government thinking about the well being of this nation, as opposed to eternally concentrating on re-election.

Rant over.
Originally Posted by Justdoinmyjob
Better yet, how about have them bid to do the job. Lowest bidder gets the job. It's not like we'd see a slip in quality of work coming out of Congress over what we have today.

I don't know why y'all are upset with these guys.

- they manage to get a pay raise every time they seek one
- they don't have a background check
- no drug testing
- only are in Washington 6 months out of the year
- when they are in Washington, they only really need to show up for votes (actually, they don't even need to show up for votes)

They seem to have one heck of a union.
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Old 11-22-2009 | 05:33 PM
  #56  
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Originally Posted by sinsilvia666
nationwide strike would be epic awesome..... period.



and this just might be the thing to tie all the pilots together for a cause.
Right...ask some air traffic controllers how well that works.
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Old 11-22-2009 | 09:23 PM
  #57  
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Originally Posted by ppilot
Right...ask some air traffic controllers how well that works.
PATCO controllers were federal employees and legally couldn't strike, that's why they were fired.

What some posters on here have mentioned is a Suspension of Service, which is basically a nationwide strike by airline pilots. ALPA organized and executed an SOS back in the 1970's due to a lack of action dealing with the new threat of hijacking. The only problem was that not every airline's pilots followed the SOS so all that really happened was a weak show of solidarity on ALPA's part on the issue.

There's a court precedent that makes an SOS legal when it's an issue of national policy that's the primary reason, not when it's over collective bargaining.

I think ALPA authorized an SOS in response to the possibility of the CVR being used in a punitive manner back in the 1980s.

A nationwide SOS isn't unprecedented, it just takes a major national issue to bring about its authorization. Whether it gets enacted is another matter.
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Old 11-22-2009 | 09:46 PM
  #58  
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Originally Posted by NinerKilo
PATCO controllers were federal employees and legally couldn't strike, that's why they were fired.

What some posters on here have mentioned is a Suspension of Service, which is basically a nationwide strike by airline pilots. ALPA organized and executed an SOS back in the 1970's due to a lack of action dealing with the new threat of hijacking. The only problem was that not every airline's pilots followed the SOS so all that really happened was a weak show of solidarity on ALPA's part on the issue.

There's a court precedent that makes an SOS legal when it's an issue of national policy that's the primary reason, not when it's over collective bargaining.

I think ALPA authorized an SOS in response to the possibility of the CVR being used in a punitive manner back in the 1980s.

A nationwide SOS isn't unprecedented, it just takes a major national issue to bring about its authorization. Whether it gets enacted is another matter.

I have very little doubt that if Clowngress passes this, ALPA will authorize another SOS - and more pilots would be on board this time. I think (and I would hope) that this garbage would cause an uproar within the industry.

I'm getting sick of these people pretending to know things...just say, "You know what, screw it, you fly the damn airplane, Congressman. Let me know when you hit the ground..err, I mean land."
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Old 11-23-2009 | 06:30 AM
  #59  
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Originally Posted by Justdoinmyjob
Better yet, how about have them bid to do the job. Lowest bidder gets the job. It's not like we'd see a slip in quality of work coming out of Congress over what we have today.
Then J.O., the rev. BB, and Hulas could organize state Senators and Representatives (regionals) to whipsaw the federal government guys (majors). The Ignorant Officials Union (I.O.U.) could push for on-the-job naps and other superfluous stipulations...this could work!
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Old 11-23-2009 | 06:53 AM
  #60  
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Originally Posted by yamahas3
So if this passes, how long until theres a major crash where hundreds of people die and the key to preventing it from happening again is on the CVR.... which is found to have been deactivated by the pilots? I wonder if congress has thought of that one yet. Way to make aviation less safe, lawmakers!

In a pure sense, deactivating CVRs and nationwide slowdowns is a lot more "unprofessional" than 2 idiots having one isolated incident flying past an airport on their laptops. Kind of funny that a "pilot professionalism act" would directly cause a decrease in professionalism. (Not that I'm against it)
That CB would be moved to the cabin or elsewhere in short order - during the deactivation of the erase button. This BS has got to be stopped in the incubator. I wrote everyone that mattered.

PIPE
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