What is the purpose of this page? Is it to scare people away? Is it to inform folks about the truth in the airline profession?

I think the material has too much slant towards being negative. Lets face it, many other careers have similar perils. People have to make informed decisions, but after reading this page, I don't see why anyone would enter the profession. And I believe that is probably not being fair to the profession.

 

If you think the site is too far slanted to the negative, then feel free to post more positives and I'll be happy to include them. I'm not trying to "scare" anyone. In fact, on the front page of the site I tell people to pursue their dreams, no matter what anyone else tells them to do.

Further, if you think many other professionals face the perils that our profession has experienced, is currently experiencing, and is lining up to experience in the future, taking into consideration the tremendous financial and personal sacrifices necessary to become a professional airline pilot, I couldn't disagree more.

 

I tend to be optimistic by nature, and I also found your site a bit of a downer. That doesn't mean it isn't factual, but as others have pointed out there ARE ways to get the training and experience out there besides huge loans and pilot-mill schools.

I grew tobacco and raised feeder cattle to earn money for a private/inst/comm/cfi rating. I squeaked a little money here and there while in college providing Part 61 flight lessons, and later got a job with the University flight department as a CFI. One of my co-workers went to ASA and now has about 10-15 years with Delta. Another roommate is a captain at American, hired after one year with ASA. Yet another flew the King Air in the right seat for the athletic department, joined the AL ANG, and flew F-16s for years and later went to Delta. Another buddy got turned down for AF duty for his vision, and bounced around some engineering jobs before chasing his muse at a variety of GA jobs, ASA, Gemini and later FedEx. I did 14 years active duty AF then bailed in 2002 to join FedEx. Most of us got degrees in aviation, did some military flying and some didn't....but we all eventually got somewhere good.

What defined our (relative) success? First--nobody is this group was trying to shortcut or buy their way into a seniority number at regional, but rather everone had a (somewhat) solid degree and some options outside the mill. I'm not sure a Comair Academy or San Juan grad has the same options, but then again I've seen plenty of those folks who have tasted success as well.

I think if you are planning on anyone else making you rich these days...be it Delta, FedEx, JetBlue, or whoever...you are out of luck. Before you cry in your beer about days gone by, consider what doctors, lawyers, and other professionals have faced in the last 20 years in real income. Most professions have lost ground or at the best are holding their own these days. The "get a number, work 30 years, retire rich" may or may not have been a reality for most folks, but it is even harder to find these days. So...what do you do?

First--I like the idea of a degree (and a passion) outside aviation. Got several friends who have law degrees, some own businesses, etc.

Second--if you like to fly, the Air National Guard/Reserve components offer an outstanding way to fly and serve your nation. I always liked being part of the home team, and the "ANG MEMBER" license plate is a source of pride for me. There are differences in units and missions, but the stability of the ANG and the diversity of flying are a nice compliment to the instability and sameness of airline flying. When the phone rings--you HAVE to go--but I loved my time in the ANG and appreciated what it did for my family.

Third--network all the time. You never know when your fellow crew member, the old classmate, or that guy you worked a few charters for back at that FBO might be your link to a great opportunity.

Finally--don't forget to count your blessings. I spent 10 days on the road over Christmas and New Years, and earlier in the month missed a daughter's birthday. It would have been an easy month to sulk and pout. But I am lucky to have this job, and lucky to have a family I get to provide for, so sometimes a good attitude really does make a difference in how you look at that commute or that delay or any one of the other 1000 irritants on the job.

 

Albief, some would say you have a great attitude because you have great jobs. I on the otherhand would say you have those jobs BECAUSE you have a great attitude. I agree with your entire post.

 

I agree. Non-flying duties are just as important as your primary AFSC. I was trying to convey the point that some guys think as mil pilots they are gonna fly their B-1 100 hours a month and spend the rest of the time shooting their watch in the O-club (token jab from your friendly neighborhood herbivore)

 

Your attitude is admirable. It sounds like all your hard work has paid off. However let us not forget that for every person like you that has made it in this industry there are another 5 pilots out there that have not been so fortunate, many times through no fault of there own. The furloughed one too many time pilot who gives up on the industry, the regional captain that is now too old to move on to more lucrative jobs because there was no hiring when he was young enough to move on, the pilot who's company got bought out and so on. The AF and guard does not take everyone. Not everyone is lucky enough to start their career on the cusp of a boom. Not everyone has made the right contacts. This career is still promising if you are smart enough to get your ratings cheaply, if you are young enough and if luck is on your side. So not to diminish your position and hard work, but lets be honest here, it sounds like you have been fairly fortunate in your career. If this were a commercial there would be something at the bottom of the screen that read results not typical.

 

I know where you and Albie are coming from, but I have one foot in the other side of aviation too.

Unfortunately the reality is that there is a lot of potential negative, especially early on. Unlike the past, the big financial payoff at the end is no longer available to most people entering the profession today. Dues paying used to make a lot more sense...

I would not refuse to recommend the profession to newcomers, but I would be very selective about who I recommend it to. The ideal person would have a true passion for aviation (as opposed to a passion for status, money, etc), would be young, motivated, educated, and single. And they would already be a private pilot...if a non-pilot wants to talk about airline careers, I tell him to go learn to fly then come talk to me.

We don't need any more mediocre kids who think it would be cool to fly a jet, have 20 days off a month, and make $300K by age 25...but couldn't have even succeeded in the general aviation world if it weren't for a puppy mill.

 

Let's talk about those non-flying duties a minute...

When I was a hard d*** captain, all I thought was important was killing migs, and anything the firm (the AF) threw in the way of training to do job 1 was a thorn in my side. And in fact, many many of the silly, stupid, time wasting activities the military is known for still rightly irritate the warrior culture.

However, I will also admit that a lot of the additional duties, especially the supervisory positions I held along the way, gave me insight into motivating, leading, and managing folks. The requirements to brief and debrief, as well as the presentation skills required for verifications, (S)WATT training, and platform instructor positions gave me the comm skills that I have used and honed in the interview and staffing business. In fact, I think the wide range of additional duties I had to do were siliently preparing me a job outside aviation in case (God forbid) I ever needed one. When I think about the lucky guy or gal who spent 2-3 years at a regional and are now senior to me at a major, I am envious of the fact they got their seat so young in life. However, I am also grateful that I have a breadth of experience and some backup options should I ever have to do anything else. Where am I going with this? Just sayin' I *****ed about additional duties about as much as any fighter pilot ever did...but a few years later I look back and realize a lot of my success both in and out of aviation came from some of the skills developed by those same *(&^ jobs.

And yeah...I've been both blessed and been lucky. I try to stay appreciative of the one who put in a position to recieve the blessings, and stay mentally and physically prepared to capitalize on any opportunities presented. I have been fortunate, but I don't think the route I have traveled required superior intellect of foresight...just some faith, dogged persistance, and the recognition that even superstars (which I ain't!) get a hand up now and then. Be faithful, work hard, network, and help others when you can...and don't forget that back up plan (or two). And if you are complaining on a clear night at 35,000 over the western US....I don't want to hear it. I'm just glad to be here...

 

Very well put. I have a buddy 55 yrs old and not ready to retire, just found out he has a medically disqualifying condition. This guy exercises regularly, doesn't smoke and drinks very, very lightly. Now he must draw from his prior experience as a Navel Officer. He may take a temporary hit on the W2, but is quite happy he has skills in addition to flying.

 

I thought the general consensus on this board was NOT to do this? Most people I've talked to say go to a local FBO, keep your job and try to pay as you go, and avoid big name or fast track schools, etc, etc? I just find it strange that no one has pointed this out yet..?