Recall of DAL MEC Officers
10-15-2013, 05:52 AM
#181
Gets Weekends Off
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Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: Still in one
Posts: 784
Originally Posted by RonRicco
The point is as it was explained to me, you need 2/3 of the votes to actually recall an officer, but if a vote is taken and the result is 50 percent plus 1 (10 votes in this case) there can them be a motion for "roll call" and then if you have 50 percent plus one votes "whoever" is recalled. (Nice run on sentence eh?)
So looking at the names on the letters, I don't see 2/3 on either one, but with a extra vote or two, either one can have the 10 needed to call for a roll call and "win."
Talking with reps who are on both sides of this issue, roll call apparently was used quite a bit on on the NWA side and almost never on the south side with the Chairman, reps and officers arguing against it.
So, I would not expect it to be pushed or called for by those who were adamantly against it in the past. That would only add to the cynicism that is already present.
Ideally, cooler heads prevail and the MEC starts acting like mature adults instead of a chapter of Mutiny on the Bounty, but the way this was handled by those that started the process have done serious damage to our unity.
So looking at the names on the letters, I don't see 2/3 on either one, but with a extra vote or two, either one can have the 10 needed to call for a roll call and "win."
Talking with reps who are on both sides of this issue, roll call apparently was used quite a bit on on the NWA side and almost never on the south side with the Chairman, reps and officers arguing against it.
So, I would not expect it to be pushed or called for by those who were adamantly against it in the past. That would only add to the cynicism that is already present.
Ideally, cooler heads prevail and the MEC starts acting like mature adults instead of a chapter of Mutiny on the Bounty, but the way this was handled by those that started the process have done serious damage to our unity.
SECTION 8 − RECALL
A. MEC officers and the ALPA member of the Delta Board of Directors (pilot director)
1. An MEC officer or the pilot director may be removed from office at any time by a two-thirds vote of the MEC conducted by secret ballot, with each MEC member having one vote.
2. A motion may be made from the floor requesting a second vote on the recall motion utilizing the roll-call procedure if at least 50 percent, but less than two-thirds, of the MEC have voted in favor of such recall. If requested, as the next order of business following the first recall vote, this motion must be allowed and will require a simple majority of roll-call votes in favor to effect the removal. (See Section 5 for roll-call vote procedures).
3. Agenda submission procedures for special MEC meetings will apply to placing the subject of recall on the agenda of either a regular or special MEC meeting if it is not on the advance agenda.
10-15-2013, 06:23 AM
#182
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: maddoggy dog
Posts: 1,026
Originally Posted by TANSTAAFL
From the PM:
[CENTER]
Also pertinent, but different procedures (ALPA Admin Manual) there is rumored to be a LEC recall underway the day before the special meeting in ATL for the junior F/O Rep because he did not exercise unity in signing the recall letter with the other three ATL Reps, to be pulled if he gets with the unity program.
[CENTER]
Also pertinent, but different procedures (ALPA Admin Manual) there is rumored to be a LEC recall underway the day before the special meeting in ATL for the junior F/O Rep because he did not exercise unity in signing the recall letter with the other three ATL Reps, to be pulled if he gets with the unity program.
That better not be true! Let the man have an opinion. Let the man choose for himself. Other councils chose not to stifle the debate. This type of crap makes my blood boil! I heard something along these lines last night. I don't want my reps to agree with each other all the time. I want them to use their individual brains. Not give in to show unity. If they happen to all agree then great. If not, don't get your panties in a wad and recall the dissenter. Grow up!!!!!
I'm looking online for council 108's response but can't find it. Anyone see it yet?
10-15-2013, 06:38 AM
#183
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 11,993
Originally Posted by TANSTAAFL
From the PM:
[CENTER]
Also pertinent, but different procedures (ALPA Admin Manual) there is rumored to be a LEC recall underway the day before the special meeting in ATL for the junior F/O Rep because he did not exercise unity in signing the recall letter with the other three ATL Reps, to be pulled if he gets with the unity program.
[CENTER]
Also pertinent, but different procedures (ALPA Admin Manual) there is rumored to be a LEC recall underway the day before the special meeting in ATL for the junior F/O Rep because he did not exercise unity in signing the recall letter with the other three ATL Reps, to be pulled if he gets with the unity program.
That means among the possible (and preferred) outcomes are unity and agreement on the same Chairman, whether it be our current Chairman, or someone else.
The strategy to threaten recall before a vote paints Reps in a corner. If they vote as demanded, then it appears they caved. If they vote against your Candidate, then you've got to defend your preemptive recall resolution.
My further concern about such a strategy is that it broadcasts that the Chairman (whoever it will be), there will be an effort to secure a LEC Rep (for his roll call votes), replace him, and launch the whole stinking mess again against the new Chairman (whoever it may be) ... so it extends the disunity into the future while we have other important work to do.
My earnest and humble guidance to all of my Reps have been to vote their conscience, for what's best for the Delta pilots (even if they happen to disagree). We need a team that respects each other, that works together and if they are on a Committee, are willing to be directed. If they are unwilling to serve their Chairman, then they should expect to be fired and take it graciously.
If the Council 44 Reps happen to agree on the best course, intelligent men with integrity can come to the same decision. I say Bravo!
Either way, I trust these men.
10-15-2013, 06:56 AM
#184
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 11,993
So ... no need to leave Robert Oppenheimer's notes on the table.
Peace through mutually assured destruction isn't my preferred form of Peace.
Peace through mutually assured destruction isn't my preferred form of Peace.
Last edited by Bucking Bar; 10-15-2013 at 07:07 AM.
10-15-2013, 07:03 AM
#185
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2009
Position: Captain
Posts: 826
Originally Posted by Bucking Bar
As an aside that very few will probably understand ... The DPA does not have a monopoly on NMB Cards. The NMB will count any cards cumulatively.
What Einstein understood before his contemporaries is that Energy can take a multitude of different forms and states, but can be dealt with as a constant. One of the forms energy can take is Mass, which has energy simply because it is. Energy at rest is highly concentrated. The conversion factor (C Squared) is responsive for the immense amount of energy released.
Those who think they've figured out the perfect nuclear option and are in the midst of executing it fail to realize they have no grasp of the math. Solve for C.
E=mc²
What Einstein understood before his contemporaries is that Energy can take a multitude of different forms and states, but can be dealt with as a constant. One of the forms energy can take is Mass, which has energy simply because it is. Energy at rest is highly concentrated. The conversion factor (C Squared) is responsive for the immense amount of energy released.
Those who think they've figured out the perfect nuclear option and are in the midst of executing it fail to realize they have no grasp of the math. Solve for C.
10-15-2013, 07:20 AM
#187
Straight QOL, homie
Joined APC: Feb 2012
Position: Record-Shattering Profit Facilitator
Posts: 4,202
Originally Posted by TANSTAAFL
Also pertinent, but different procedures (ALPA Admin Manual) there is rumored to be a LEC recall underway the day before the special meeting in ATL for the junior F/O Rep because he did not exercise unity in signing the recall letter with the other three ATL Reps, to be pulled if he gets with the unity program.
If his votes/actions are not in line with the wishes of his constituents, wouldn't they be justified attempting to recall him?
10-15-2013, 07:31 AM
#188
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,569
If this is true I will consider sending in a DPA card and I'm a alpa volunteer. Truly disgusting. Our junior rep and AA in SEA should be the new face/type we elect in all councils to change Alpa from within. This is what the DPA should have been doing all along. Smart, engaged, realistic and junior with many years left. This top down, military structure has no place in today's industry. We need forward thinkers, not good soldiers who follow the leader just to show a perceived unity. I have put in a call to the other 3 ATL reps to get their view on this but don't expect a call back. That being said, if they or their surrogates actually do this, heads must roll. There are enough junior to mid seniority pilots fed up with this mafia like behavior by the old guard. My first choice would be a recall of the remaining ATL reps and anyone associated with the old guard in other councils and change Alpa from within(I think there is a window here, but its almost like the old guard wants to hand the keys to DPA)
Originally Posted by TANSTAAFL
From the PM:
[CENTER]
Also pertinent, but different procedures (ALPA Admin Manual) there is rumored to be a LEC recall underway the day before the special meeting in ATL for the junior F/O Rep because he did not exercise unity in signing the recall letter with the other three ATL Reps, to be pulled if he gets with the unity program.
[CENTER]
Also pertinent, but different procedures (ALPA Admin Manual) there is rumored to be a LEC recall underway the day before the special meeting in ATL for the junior F/O Rep because he did not exercise unity in signing the recall letter with the other three ATL Reps, to be pulled if he gets with the unity program.
10-15-2013, 07:33 AM
#189
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,569
TFB! If there was a place to discuss this, we'd be there. For now this is it.
Originally Posted by nwaf16dude
This whole thing is freakin' embarrassing. As bad as the DALPA forums could be, at least we weren't showing our @sses on a public forum.
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