Eric Stratton

I was told that RA also made the statement that since the price of oil has continued to climb there isn't enough money to to pay the nwa pilots only the delta pilots. it sounds like he is talking out of both sides of his mouth.

I would agree with you about having everyone happy creates a better company to realise the benefits of the merger but hasn't that always been true of any airline (or company) throughout history? History says that airline management has always fought against pilots even in the times of huge profits unless they have something the company wants. hopefully the harmony and realising the those profits will be enough. we'll know in about 8 months.

Bucking Bar

That, unfortnately, might be true.

The train was leaving the station. The Delta pilots Reps chose to get on since the train's departure was inevitable. The NWA pilots decided to try to stop the train and thus far have had no effect on the direction or velocity of the locomotive.

Certainly the NWA pilots will get DAL's (now reduced since we did not get the SLI dela done) pay rates, but the equity opportunity is allegedly gone.

Bucking Bar

Yes... and not just pay rates, I hope some of the NWA pilots' aggression is directed at Section 1. We need the NWA guys on board and I think they will love working for Delta. It's a good place.

2themoon

In Dave Stevens letter to NWA pilots on April 14th he said the NWA MEC personnally meet with Anderson and was informed of this merger. You say they where not notified? The NWA MEC knew beforehand that this was going thru. They have may not wanted this but that is a lot different then not knowing about it. Don't blame you future " brothers and sisters" for that.

Jay5150

Eric,

Here's one example:

"would it hurt the delta 88 pilots or nwa 9 pilots more? meaning could delta now replace the 9 easier with this new relaxed scope?

why would the delta pilot group even think about loosening the scope language any more?"

(sorry, I don't know how to quote from another thread.)

But here, you immediately assume that the scope changes have to do with parking -9s and adding RJs and are just aghast that the Delta pilots would even consider this.

Of course, then it was explained to you that this scope relaxation had to to with keeping all of NW big iron flying. Your biggest source of information seems to come from your "new hire buddy", which you take as gospel truth and entirely accurate.

And no, I still don't see how this merger has anything to do with you. As far as precedents being set, I don't see it. Maybe with regards to past arbitration decisions of similar mergers influencing future arbitration decisions. But as far as anything else, no.

AA/TWA had their own set of issues and hurdles and was for them to deal with. The same with USAIR/AWA. DAL/NWA, in my opinion, has it's own hurdles and arguments, but in the end affects only DAL/NWA guys. I don't see CAL and UAL walking into their negotiations saying, "well DAL and NWA did this or that, so that's the way it should be here" NO. CAL has 3-4 year captains. USAIR had what, 1900 guys on furlough when those two merged. TWA, according to many, had one foot in the grave.

All of these situations are unique and have little to no bearing on how things should be done in someone else's merger scenario. They certainly have no bearing on the day to day life of someone who works for neither.

Jay5150

Eric

From another thread you said:


"they chose only to look out for the original delta pilots not the up and coming delta pilots. I say this because it only takes effect once the merger goes through. at that same time all nwa pilots become delta pilots. you have to ask youself what did the delta pilots gain from this. it's leverage to hold over the nwa pilot in regards to the SLI. I'm not sure how this will play out but they also added a no furlough clause for their side only."

Absolutely False.

The pilot groups become one when a SLI is either agreed upon or arbitrated, and we begin working under a joint contract. The date that the merger goes through has nothing at all to do with it.

With regards to your last statement, the DAL MEC has absolutely no authority to negotiate anything for the NW guys right now. They could no more get them money, or work rules or equity or anything else any more than they could for the local Steel Workers Union.

You went on to say that DAL shouldn't have relaxed their scope and "damaged" this merger, I think is what you said. The DAL MEC believes that this merger is going through with or without pilot approval and with or without those contract changes. The LOA has to do with extracting value now (and not parking international airplanes by the way) so that the end result is a better joint contract for all of us. Not some sort of screw job for NW guys. How could it be? They are working under the exact same contract that they were before all this started. They won't be on a B-scale. We are 2 seperate pilot groups. The day that we are not, the joint contract goes into effect and everybody is paid the same rates.

Eric Stratton

if you notice at the end of those sentences there are questions marks. I was trying to figure out what was relaxed in the scope clause. I've never heard of anyone loosening the top end of scope. by buddy did say that it was 100 seaters and I'm completely against any airline loosening scope in that way.

gospel truth, no but guess what delta does have a history of giving up scope for pay. so it was believeable. kind of did it here this time as well. you got it as well as assuring that only the nwa guys get furloughed prior to a SLI.

if you don't think that others look at what happens with past and present mergers I think thats kind of naive. if the division between the 2 pilot groups causes big problems I'm betting that ual or cal would try and avoid those mistakes rather than repeat them. If it works out they could try and imitate them if the opprotunity presented itself.

tsquare

It's not that good...

Justdoinmyjob

Prior to an SLI the NW guys are NorthWest, subject to the NW PWA and operated as an independant and separate carrier. Only after an SLI are they Delta. Seems to me that you are saying, prior to an SLI, if NW decides to park the -9s and furlough, then a DL pilot should be let go. That makes about as much sense as a CAL pilot being let go if AA decides to furlough.

Now, if the NW MEC believes that furloughs are a real possibility, then it would behoove them to either make a deal with THEIR management (ie Steenland,) or better yet, come back to the negotiating table and work out a JOINT contract with the DL pilots which would then protect their constituents.

One other factor here that comes to mind, once there is an SLI, the NW MEC would most likely be disbanded and the new DL MEC, comprising all LECs, would probably be led by a Deltoid, not necessarily Moak, but their posturing could be a tactic to remain in power.

newKnow

That letter said that they met with him a day or two before it was announced. Someone else on here said that they had notice some other way, so I'll just leave it at that.