United CPP comes to Mesa
 

http://www.keyc.com/story/37778480/mesa-airlines-announces-career-path-program-for-pilots-with-united-airlines

What y'all think?

I think we need more details. Not sure how it works with a company that flies for two seperate airlines.

That's true. How would that jive? Maybe they'll only count hrs when you fly the United express brand? That would be kind of shi*ty though.

If it works like Xjet, you have to be a current United Express pilot and prior hours will count toward the requirement to qualify for the interview.

What’s idiotic is we can’t get people through Ejet training now.... maybe, this will make IAD senior.....

What's the issue in training? Ppl not showing up?

Not enough sim time

Ejet training program is in shambles. Waiting for it to be fixed. My definition of fixed is 3 months from DOH to IOE. I think they are still working on getting the August and September classes to IOE.

Here’s hoping old time works. 9+ years in ORD/IAD here. Hate to bid back to IAD just to qualify.

For an XJT or Commutair pilot interviewing successfully today through the CPP, what class dates can they expect?
This'll give MAG pilots some sort of a time frame

I think the email says something like current and future UAX pilots.

I just got a call back from recruiting. . . 10% of the yearly united hiring from Mesa's CPP. Still have to take the test, still need a 4 year degree. 3,000 SIC 121, 2,000 PIC 121. They are expecting to hire 400-1000 per year for the next five years... so you can do the math on that.

Which would exclude past UAX pilots.

Basically, 5 years of flying before an interview. And, 40 to 100 pilots from Mesa. I suspect we already send 20 to 30 to United already per year from IAH alone.

Sometime around forever. These CPP scams are just recruiting gimmicks to get new hires to come to these regionals.

Yep, really nothing to see here. Besides, if it doesn’t benefit the entire pilot group do we want it?

That is another problem with it. Here at XJT, it isn’t open to those flying for AA and DL.

So is that:
5000 Total Hours at Mesa (3000 SIC + 2000 PIC)
OR
3000 SIC at Mesa OR
2000 PIC at Mesa

Big difference. Can anyone clarify?

I believe ExpressJet is 3000 TT at ExpressJet, but don’t quote me on that. Can an ExpressJet pilot clarify? I can’t imagine it would be that vastly different than the ExpressJet agreement.

OR. . . just OR. . .

All that and you still need a 4 year degree? lol Like you haven't suffered long enough at Mesa to just meet the hour requirements and be good to go. That is more torture then getting a 4 year. Talk about dedication. If you don't have a 4 year you are not a real pilot apparently in United's eyes. That is such a joke. Some of the worst pilots I have flown with when I was at Mesa also had MBA's... Some of the best, none. I feel for all you Mesa pilots who have a 2 year or none at all.

Who did JO have to JO to get this CPP?

So now a flood of CRJ guys bid the ERJ??

Just get out. United is a dumpster fire. They don’t know what to do.

an alarm bell must have gone off at United.

We still have zero hard numbers on what the CPP will be at Air Wisconsin, so I would treat the 10% number provided by the recruiter with extreme skepticism.

United is in a tough place with their regional feed from a staffing perspective. They have no wholly owned carriers (and are effectively prohibited from having any due to agreements with their unions) which places them at a disadvantage compared to American and Delta.

For those of us flying for United Express, the CPP is either going to end up as a winning lottery ticket or it will be a slow death march of understaffed brutal schedules. There really is no in between. It is in United’s best interests to make the CPP a massive success. Otherwise they are going to run out of people to fly RJ’s and provide feed.

This is all just a carrot to keep people around longer. Mesa attrition is high and this is a quick copy and past “flex seal” patch to stop the bleeding... most Mesa Jumpseaters i have talked to have class dates at Endeavor ect...

OR they might just have to become the first legacy airline to fly 76-seat jets again --GASP-- on their own certificate. Bet there will be no shortage of pilots to fill the seats then...

Money and bona fide career progression speaks volumes.

[Furthermore, they could then figure out how to cram 84 seats on the same jets since they wouldn't have to worry about scope!]

One can hope. I agree that this would be the best possible scenario for everyone involved. I also firmly believe that the first Major that brings the small jets in house will be in a much better position from a staffing standpoint 5-10 years from now than the majors that do not.

United is clueless. If you fly for UEX, get out. If you are thinking of coming to UEX, Do not!

Okay, ive been reading these forums for a while and this sentence has forced me to finally make an account and reply. Where do you come up with this S$&!? If people are taking that long there is seriously something wrong. The training footprint currently is just under 3 or right on 3 months. Not great but nowhere near the 7-8 you are saying.....

Or am I misunderstanding, I intiially thought this comment was made in reference to XJT. After a second read I realize I may be wrong here.

Sorry to be a testament to calmwinds, but yes it is taking 6-7 months at Mesa in the EJet. I started mid Oct, and I just got my sim schedule starting end of March. It will be end of April, almost May when I’m done. (Hopefully)

Not to derail...CPP is definitely a carrot dangle/recruitment item

Wow! Ok, so what do/did you do while waiting? Please don't tell me they make you stay in Phoenix?

................

Enjoyed time at home honestly. Hit the books once a week to at least try and stay current lol.

I know of a few that tried to stay in PHX, but rumor is they were eventually told to go home. I know of a few from my class quit recently.

Majors flying their regional feed sounds great at first until you think of the fact that it will most likely be a pay cut. Yes united will hire pay more for each seat than a regional but I can almost bet they will put new hires from regional into the 76 passenger jet for a few years. The progression would be Air Wisconsin or mesa FO for 2 years, then captain for 3 before moving to united. When you leave the regional you will be making 75ish and hour will most likely take a pay cut to sit do for 4 more years making mid 60s as a fo at United on the same regional jet. Yes the mid 60s is more than a regional pays a FO but they will just be filling those seats with prior regional guys. The period of changing from regional flying to all in house will basically screw everyone that has paid their dues by further stunting career progression. About 5 years in it will be great for the guys at 1500 as they will be able to go straight to a major but there will be a price to pay for those during the transition. Let me get my seniority number and be senior enough to not be stuck in a RJ for both a regional and major.

I don’t think we will see 76-seat jets being flown by legacies (at least not anytime soon). What I do think you’ll see is each legacy flying something akin to the C-Series with 100 seats within the next 5 years. And their training departments already can’t keep up with demand. That is when things will get interesting in my opinion.

"I know of a few that tried to stay in PHX, but rumor is they were eventually told to go home. I know of a few from my class quit recently."

Most in Phoenix have been told their hotels would NOT be extended, even though Mesa caused this debacle. They have been waiting for the email that never comes, the schedule that's never confirmed, and structure that is completely lacking.

Some were even called back for an FPT class and when their hotel time ran out mid-class, it wasn't extended. I think some of those guys just picked up and left.

This is clearly Mesa's problem and Mesa's problem to fix...but in typical Mesa fashion, they act like it's not their fault, have no responsibility to the pilot recruits they've jerked around and lied to, and everyone else must accommodate them. To leave your new hires essentially dangling in the wind, with no direction, no hotel, and no schedule is disgraceful.

Well and what does that do to your PRIA record if you quit in the middle?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If you think about it, what you describe is what's already going on with the WOs (psa, envoy, pied). It's just worded differently. They have a flow (no additional interview) which put them on the mainline seniority list in 5 to 7 yrs. So one can say they are already in with American but still getting regional pilot pay. Basically AA keeps the eagle pilots in the illlusion that they are working regional so its easier to accept regional pay and keep the regional idea alive.

It's all words, just like numbers.

3+3= 6

Also 2+5-1 = 6

To any Mesa guys complaining about a 4 year degree requirement all I can say is be happy you get a hand out watered down interview! I know countless of my former colleagues at other regionals/LCC’s with close to 8-10,000 hours, 4 year degree, PIC time galore, LCA, Union leadership positions, etc and can’t get an interview.

Absolutely none of us at United care if you have “suffered” at Mesa and feel you deserve to come here without meeting a pretty basic requirement for a career opportunity that wasnt earned, rather lucked into because United and Mesa can’t staff the operation without dangling this carrot.

To the good guys at Mesa that understand how fortunate they are to have this opportunity, I wish you all good luck in the interview and hope to see you on property soon.

It depends on what the regional (or major or wherever) you are going to asks for. If it is just a PRIA, then you quit while training if there were no busts. If the company ask for your detailed training records, and you sign a release, then hopefully, everything was passed to this point with flying colors.

This training disaster is a perfect excuse for picking up and going elsewhere.