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Old 01-21-2006, 12:45 PM
  #11  
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Chief Allick is the know it all, but she was very UNhelpful, and she was the one dealing with Force Shaping, not Palace Chase... I got out under Palace Chase. Lil' Jerry... do you fly for UPS, or do something else, and how do you pull 3K per month from the reserves... that sounds like a lot of TDY to me.
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Old 01-21-2006, 04:35 PM
  #12  
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I'll be going through the PC process within the next month, so I'll let you guys know how it goes.

I wouldn't worry about getting "blackballed". This is a career move for yourself. This is not "bailing" out of the military. You are still in the military and can still be activated at any time. Noone else is going to look out for #1 accept for you. You do what you have to do for you and don't worry about what people will think. Just my .02.
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Old 01-22-2006, 07:46 AM
  #13  
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Originally Posted by TankerDriver
I'll be going through the PC process within the next month, so I'll let you guys know how it goes.

I wouldn't worry about getting "blackballed". This is a career move for yourself. This is not "bailing" out of the military. You are still in the military and can still be activated at any time. Noone else is going to look out for #1 accept for you. You do what you have to do for you and don't worry about what people will think. Just my .02.
Nice name! Agree 100% with the look out for one's self attitude. However, as I understand PC, you are taking a chance. Nothing is for sure. My bet would be that if if a person were to apply and be turned down for some reason, their career in the active duty air force would not be much fun for the next few years. Maybe there is someone on this forum who has been turned down and can fill the rest of us in? For those that have applied, thanks for having the cajones to lead the way. I definitely would not jump into the process without being very well informed about the risks involved though.
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Old 01-22-2006, 10:22 AM
  #14  
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Originally Posted by Tanker-driver
Nice name! Agree 100% with the look out for one's self attitude. However, as I understand PC, you are taking a chance. Nothing is for sure. My bet would be that if if a person were to apply and be turned down for some reason, their career in the active duty air force would not be much fun for the next few years. Maybe there is someone on this forum who has been turned down and can fill the rest of us in? For those that have applied, thanks for having the cajones to lead the way. I definitely would not jump into the process without being very well informed about the risks involved though.

Yeah, thats my feeling exactly. If you get turned down then you're stuck on AD and you've showed your hand that your not bleeding blue and trying to do an AD career. Depending on your CC he may not want to fight hard for you to get your next assignment or school slot or whatever else you decide to do. You may still wearing the uniform by going ANG or USAFR but as far as AD is concerned you've seperated.... I talked to the PC office at RND and they told me they didnt need anymore pilots to get out especially in my year group. I feel like it would be a big crap shoot for me. However, the AF times came out last week and said the AF will need to cut another 55K airman over the next 5 yrs so we'll see if the 29 Sep remains to be the cutoff date for PCing...
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Old 01-22-2006, 03:14 PM
  #15  
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If I were happy on AD, I wouldn't be doing this. I've only been at my duty station for about a year and squadron CC's come and go like the seasons, so I'm not very worried about a CC not fighting for a good assignment for me after this because chances are, I'm going to have at least 2 or 3 more CC's before I get another assignment. If you're a hard worker, don't get in trouble and do your best at everything you do, you should not be penalized for trying to seperate. It's a risk I'm willing to take.

I'm an '03 1Lt. I'm hoping they still need a few of us out.
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Old 01-23-2006, 06:45 AM
  #16  
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Guard pay is very complicated. But in general, you can take your gross and divide it by 30. That's what you get in the guard for an active duty day or for one UTA period. You could do the same thing with your net after taxes to find out your take home pay.

A "drill pay" pay period is 4 hours. You do 4 "UTA's" on a drill weekend. You get paid 4 days pay for working two days. You'd be taking home around $600 if you are Captain over 8.

An FTP, which you get for flying, is the same as a UTA for pay purposes -- a 4 hour period. Heavy drivers can do 2 FTP's on one sortie if it is over 4 hours. You get 48 FTP's per year, with no more than 16 in a quarter, and I believe no more than 6 (maybe 8) in one month. You are bound by this 48 limit by law -- you can't ask for more. So you get 48 FTP's and 48 UTA's a year. That's 96 pay periods for double pay.

Then there are "Active Duty" days. These can be AT's (Annual Training) -- you are guaranteed about 15. They can be "Mandays" -- I call these gifts from the active duty Air Force -- normally funded by other sources. All of these are 1 for 1, i.e., 1 AT = 1/30th of your active duty pay.

There are more... PT's, etc. Some are active duty, some are inactive duty. Unless your unit tells you otherwise, you can only bank on 96 FTP's/UTA's and your 15 AT's. I would consider that your "minimum" for the year. Keep in mind that since you can front load your FTP's, times could get lean at the end of the year when you run out. Actually, this can happen each quarter if you front load the quarter.

So can you "trough" and make it? Lots of guys do -- but it takes a serious change in lifestyle and/or outside employment. I ask guys up front if they intend to trough before hiring them. You should tell your unit leadership truthfully what your plans are -- otherwise you could end up on the short end of the money stick. They will tell you what the outlook is for extra pay days so you can plan accordingly.

I advise guys jumping for AD to the ANG to have a BUCKET of cash in savings. You might not get paid anything for a couple of months, then when the check shows up, mama might have sticker shock. "Where is the rest of it?" Yikes.

Then there are the "temp" jobs. Temp AGR (Active Guard/Reserve) is identical to being on active duty sans bonus. Temp Tech is technician or civil service. A young captain can be lured into the Tech because it equals what a senior major or young L/C makes. As a technician, you also get FTP's and UTA's. You only get 12 FTP's a quarter or 36/year, since they know you are getting some flying done in technician status. Being a temp tech or temp AGR is a great way to bridge the gap to the airlines or other employment. You should ask up front if these might be available to you. Regardless, have your bucket ready -- you still may see significant pay delays.

Get ready to work. If you have an airline job, you still have to do your drill weekends and FTP's. Airline guys in my squadron work their butts off. 17 days at SWA, plus commutes, plus 6 days minimum at the guard equates to 4 or 5 days off a month. Senior SWA guys, and with other carriers pre-911, give away trips and get more time off -- but very few aren't watching the calendar waiting for 20 years military so they can hang it up.

Let me know if I just generated more questions.

-Elvis
 
Old 01-23-2006, 07:14 AM
  #17  
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Good info Elvis. Thanks.

I have been preparing for this for a while. Paying off as many bills as I can and throwing cash in the savings. I fortunately have a a spouse that can make almost twice as much as I do right now on active duty in her profession, but unfortunately is unemployed right now because we happen to be stationed in an area that doesn't have many job opportunities for her (which is something we'll probably deal with for the next 8 years if I don't seperate). This is leading factor in my decision to seperate from AD to the ANG. We are trying to go to a specific unit in an area with a few options for her. I don't think we'll have much of a problem with me making less than I do now.
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Old 01-23-2006, 12:56 PM
  #18  
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Something else to consider, if someone else can clarify, I believe your remaining commitment, if above 6 years, cannot be more than 6 years if you PC to the Reserves or Guard. So, for example, if you've got 8 1/2 years left of your AD service commitment (like I do), it'd drop down to 6 in the ANG. If you've got 2 years left, it's multiplied by 2 and you go up to 4, but again, not to exceed 6.
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Old 01-23-2006, 01:19 PM
  #19  
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I'm curious- how much does a 10 year 0-3 active duty pilot make vs. the available range of starting salaries available commercially.

If you are halfway to a gauranteed pension and upgrade to Captain is 7 years (SWA example) or more- where does the strictly financial breakpoint lie? Disregarding QOL issues.
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Old 01-23-2006, 03:01 PM
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OldAg84,

With 10 years in, you'd most likely be an O-4 or very close to it. As a Major with 10+ years in service using the new 2006 pay tables, base pay is $5,482.20 a month. As a pilot, you will get flight pay, which at 6+ years is an extra $650 a month. BAS (Basic Allowance for Substanance) is $187.49 right now and BAH (Basic Allowance for Housing), which you get if you live off base, varies with location (zip code). For example, BAH where I am right now for an O-4 is $1,299.00 a month with dependents. So, when all is said and done, an O-4 with 10+ is bringing home $7,618.69 a month or $91,424.28 a year before taxes (and BTW, the only thing taxed is base pay and flight pay). Then of course there is the pilot bonus, which gives you $125,000 (taxable) over 5 years if you sign for 5 more after your 10 year commitment is up. As you can see, when it comes to money alone, AD is hard to beat. As a 2Lt right out of commissioning, you're making near $40,000 a year. As an O-2 with a little over 3 years in, being deployed as much as I am (I was tax free 6 out of the last 7 months), I'm bringing home about $5,500 a month with hazardous duty, hardship and family seperation pays, all tax free. Very hard to give that up. It's nice having a pay check on the 1st and 15th of the month and not having to worry about it. As you can see, once you get to that 10 year point, most likely having a family to support, it's hard to seperate and start over. Having to go back to square one in the right seat for a major airline making $35,000 a year on probation and maybe $55,000 from there after (all of which is taxed), can be tough.

The thing you have to understand is that AD is not a flying career. At least to me it's not. Flying is only part of the job and sometimes very little part. When I'm not deployed, I fly maybe 15-20 hours a month tops. The rest of the time I'm flying a desk chair doing paperwork feeling like a secretary and it only gets worse as you make more rank. Once you're an O-4 or O-5, you'll definitely be in the office more than the cockpit on active duty. In my opinion, you can't compare being an airline or corporate pilot to being a pilot in the military, because you're being payed to be an officer, not a pilot. I only get $150 a month for flight pay. That shows you how much flying is worth to the military. I came from a civilian/commercial backround before joining AD. I got into this thinking I would fly more and have a job which revolved more around flying, but unfortunately, it doesn't.
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