ARL120384

First off,

thanks to all the guys who have sent PM's answering my questions, but I'll repost them for some fresh blood to see. This is my spin off of the Airline to Military thread. I have many many questions, but because the MIL page here on APC is rather brief, I thought I'd start a new thread. Im currently going on 28 (Dec) and work in the Regionals, and have for 6 years. Somewhat stable, but would like to avoid a move if at all possible. Ive always wanted to be in some form of military aviation. I know my days are numbered with my age, so here are my questions...

Guard or AD or Reserve? Whats the benefits of both, and if AD, benefits of each branch? I would like to stay in the airlines, and I think Guard would be the best, because I can live locally. Theres an ARW 35 mins from my house, and a few others in Mass. to choose from.

Is it correct, that you need to apply for a Guard slot, as if it was a regular job, and its dependent on available positions, and you passing a pre-entrance exam? And if AD, does it work the same way? Do you choose by aircraft, or location, or both?

Whats quality of life, and daily job duties of a full time/part time pilot? I'm obviously familiar with the civilian world, and my 4/3 schedule. What are schedules like as a military pilot, while not deployed?

These days, are you pretty much guaranteed being mobilized, whether AD or not?

As a Guard guy, do you have to do X amount of years AD before reverting to guard, or right out of training do you go back to the normal world, and do your 1 weekend/2 weeks?

What type of retirement/regular bennies does a Guard guy get, if he does say, 25 years of Guard? I know retirement is based on years of AD, and X amount of converted AD, if you're in the Guard. At least thats what I've been told. What does the weekend/2 weeks in the Guard consist of?

I think thats about it for now, in the interest of keeping the first post short. Thanks in advance!

ARL

rickair7777

First off at age 28 you have probably missed the boat...age waivers exist but are unlikely as we are on short final to an era of massive cutbacks.

I think the Army National Guard has a higher age cutoff for helo pilots, I would look there.

If you want fixed wing you need to contact some units and see where they stand with age.

AD vs. Guard reserves is a much larger question than you seem to realize...

I would suggest AD only if you want to do that for a career (instead of airlines), or cannot get into the ANG. You can do about ten years (actually even 15) AD and then return to your airline with seniority intact (as though you never left). But I doubt you'll be able to make it to 20 years AD and keep your airline job, it has to do with the way the USERRA law is written. AD will involve occasional flying and full-time doing everything but flying (sometime for years with no flying). You will also need a masters degree to make it past about 12 years.

The ANG would be more a part-time gig where you keep your existing life and job (although it is a major time commitment, not to be taken lightly). ANG will involve more flying than AD.

At this point you need to get definitive answers on age limits so you know what's even possible. Age rules change with demand so I won't venture to guess exactly where things stand today, other than that you may be to old for most opportunities.

EvilMonkey

Army is 32, waiverable to 34. I'm going through the board process right now at 29, PM if you'd like more info.

Good luck!

ARL120384

Thanks all for the info! The youngest I've heard is 30. I know years back it was 28, but that was since moved. How is the Guard such a major time commitment more than active duty? Just curious.

Thanks again!

rickair7777

2-3 years (or something like that) AD for initial training. Then 4-6 days/month, plus some exercises each year, plus possibly getting mobilized for 90-400 days, etc.

It's your current life with a lot of extra time demands.

Regular AD wipes out your current life and gives you a new one. Simpler than guard/reserves.

crewdawg

Warning...this post is sponsored/fueled by Jack Daniels.

Guard (or Reserve), hands down...especially if you wish to stick with the airlines. I can't count how many times i've heard an active guy say, "wish I would have joined the guard." I have never heard a guard guy say, "I wish I would have gone active."

Having said that, the benefit of AD is a guaranteed (mostly) paycheck for the next 10-12 years...that's all i've got on that. Down side you have almost zero control over what/if you will fly, where you will live, how long you will stay in one location. Also, you may get one 3-year assignment flying then be sent to UAVs or even a non-flying job such as ALO. No guarantee you fly the whole 10 years.

The beauty of the Guard is you can generally pick your location and even which airframe you want to fly. Obviously, for fighters you have to do well enough to track 38s. If your life changes and you want to move, you can switch squadrons with relative ease...as long as you're a good dude.

Think of applying for a pilot slot in the guard as rushing a frat. They want to know if you they will be able to stand deploying with, partying with and generally having you around for the next 20 years. Yes, you will have to put together a cover letter, Resume, LORs and Scores (more on that below), submit it to the squadron and hope for an interview. They will then conduct interviews that may include hanging with the squadron over a drill weekend.

Word of advice. I would select a few squadrons you like and try to make an appearance at a drill weekend. Booze is always welcome (Jack is a crowd favorite)! Hang out, be a good dude, but don't suck up too much. Know generally what their mission is and what they do on a day-to-day basis.

You will need to take the following tests. Air Force Officer Qualifying Test (AFOQT) and the TBAS. I highly recommend getting some books to help you study. You can get these on amazon or at most book stores. You can't really study for the TBAS, it's more of a hand eye coordination thing. These are administered at most college ROTC detachments or military bases. Google them.

QOL can swing as wildly as the airline industry. But generally my QOL is much better than any of my airline bros that I graduated college with. Also, I make way more $$$ and most of the time have more time off.

One thing you must remember that in the military, you are an officer first and a pilot second. Sometimes you may think that flying is actually your secondary job. You negate this a little by joining the Guard/Reserve but it still rings true. Having said that, there are various jobs that need to be filled around the SQ (fighter squadron in this example because that's all I know).

Weapons: Your job is to be an expert latest tactics, weapon systems, etc... It's also your job to teach the rest of the squadron what you know, because they don't always have the time to dig into the books like you do. This is where you want to be, as it is most applicable to your job of killing the enemy and breaking their stuff!

Stan/Eval: These are the dudes that give check rides, issue FCIFs, and other boring stuff.

Safety: It's a black hole from which it's difficult to escape. These are the guys that keep up on the latest mishaps and brief you on them quarterly. They also do such tasks as identifying and mitigating such safety hazards as wet floors and that octopus of electric cords you have plugged into the surge protectors.

Scheduling: Most under appreciated jobs in the squadron. Everyone hates you, but wants to be your best friend. Make this guy mad...good luck! Tasks include freaking the f out when the schedule blows up in the morning brief and yelling at people randomly and for no reason. Sometimes, they even talk to the wall...it's best to keep your distance if this does occur. You'll drink lots off coffee/red bull/dew and most likely will take up smoking. You'll shave a few years off your life and give up flying to to make sure the schedule gets built...you will hate life!

ADO/DO/SQ CC: These three positions are where your tactical knowledge and ability go to die. You want the push these jobs off as long as possible. It takes a while to get to these jobs, so you'll be brain washed into this positions later in your career.

Very few mobilizations have happened in the ANG in the last 10 years. You most likely will be deployed from time to time, but mobilizations don't happened all that often (barring WWIII). Deployments do not equal mobilization.

You can count on about 2-3 years on AD for training (depending on airframe). When you get back home, you will do 1.5-2 years full time (for fighters) at your base, to get your skills up to a point where you can go part time. Then, if there are no full time jobs, you will go part time. As a part time in a fighter unit, I would count on 4-6 days/month, minimum! We do various 1-2 week trips throughout the year, that you can chose to go on or not. Plan on a 60-70 day deployment every 1.5-2 years...again, many times these are voluntary, as we usually have enough volunteers to full the trip. But you should want to go on these deployments...this is what we hired you for and what you train for! If you don't want to be in the first wave of night 1 of the war...you might want to consider another line of work.

You will get something once you hit 60. There are ways to work a 20 year retirement just like the AD guys get...but worry about that later. If you want to be an AF pilot bad enough, this won't sway your decision.


I know of at least 3 dudes who didn't even decide to apply for the Guard until they were already 28. For the AF you just need to be in pilot training by the age of 30. One those dudes, was hired and in UPT within 9 months. It can be done, but I wouldn't waste any time...if you're serious about this then you need to start getting your fecal matter co-located in the the same sock...and fast!

Note: I knew of two dudes who received age waivers but these are VERY rare and would not count on it. One had an extremely high powered recommendation.

HoursHore

At age 28 you need to start tomorrow. Call the units and ask for the chief pilot or whoever is in charge of pilot hiring. Talk to officers and hopefully someone is around who can help. In your area you have NH 135, ME 135 MA c5 Units. You'd be considered local for all of them except maybe Bangor.

ARL120384

Great write up, and thanks! I'll get on looking for some openings.

ARL120384

Should I bother to take this test ahead of time, or should I make sure that there's even a possibility before hand? I know theres a study book out there you can get on amazon, and was wondering before I hear back from the recruiters, if I should get a head start.

Thanks!

crewdawg

Why would there not be a possibility? Get that book and start studying. FYI, You can usually find them at the library as well.