SATSair....Heads Up
11-26-2007, 04:07 PM
#41
Snakes & Nape
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: B-767 Captain
Posts: 775
EJECT !! You're on fire hrdlndg.
Intel says that there are 15 A/C flying, 1 "not on certificate" and 11 down for maintenance. Let's see...that's 44.4% of the total fleet down and NOT available. Not a pretty picture and from what you said was on the phoncon, maybe it is time to bail out.
Where is that life raft on the Cirrus....I DO know where the 'chute is...standby.."Hey Center, this is Aerocab EJECTING !!
Intel says that there are 15 A/C flying, 1 "not on certificate" and 11 down for maintenance. Let's see...that's 44.4% of the total fleet down and NOT available. Not a pretty picture and from what you said was on the phoncon, maybe it is time to bail out.
Where is that life raft on the Cirrus....I DO know where the 'chute is...standby.."Hey Center, this is Aerocab EJECTING !!
11-26-2007, 07:36 PM
#42
Line Holder
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Posts: 36
Phantom Flyer,
Did you interview with Satsair and not get hired? Just wondering why you're so eager to see it fail?
I think everyone that quits on Satsair now, will be like the guys who quit Federal Express when they struggled with the Falcon 20s.
Satsair....I'm pullin for ya!!! Customers love it! Great idea!
Did you interview with Satsair and not get hired? Just wondering why you're so eager to see it fail?
I think everyone that quits on Satsair now, will be like the guys who quit Federal Express when they struggled with the Falcon 20s.
Satsair....I'm pullin for ya!!! Customers love it! Great idea!
11-27-2007, 12:05 PM
#43
Line Holder
Joined APC: Sep 2007
Posts: 54
What I do know is that you can't sell your product for less than it costs! Why wouldn't the customers "Love it" ...for them it's a "no brain'er". I have flown many of them whom have asked that question(How do they do it for the price they charge).I smile and say "astute management". In fact two or three were going to purchase their own aircraft until they found out about Sats. Satsair-Fed-EX is a poor analogy in my opinion. Satsair,LLC. is a Pyramid game. Have you ever seen a balance sheet...I think not!
11-27-2007, 03:08 PM
#44
Line Holder
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Posts: 36
"astute management"? What does that mean?
A quick and dirty balance sheet shows - 20,000 hrs/yr @$500/hr=$10M/yr
Fuel at $5.50/g x 20gph x 20,000 hrs= $2.2M
Salaries+maintenance+payments+etc= ?
Less than $8.8M...surely.
And when Federal Express started with Falcon 20s, Fred asked pilots to pay for fuel with their own money, and he went to Vegas once to make enough for a payroll.
A quick and dirty balance sheet shows - 20,000 hrs/yr @$500/hr=$10M/yr
Fuel at $5.50/g x 20gph x 20,000 hrs= $2.2M
Salaries+maintenance+payments+etc= ?
Less than $8.8M...surely.
And when Federal Express started with Falcon 20s, Fred asked pilots to pay for fuel with their own money, and he went to Vegas once to make enough for a payroll.
11-27-2007, 04:15 PM
#45
Line Holder
Joined APC: Sep 2007
Posts: 54
For every hour of revenue flights they have ...they fly at least,if not more deadlegs. But of course those are expense free. Return of "fuzzy" economics I think. All they have to do is "Show us the Money" I've been around here long enough to see all the "waste" that goes on just in my assignments, but will be gone soon. Maybe Satsair will be flying MD-11's also in the future but I will miss it. Get a job at Net Jets...Warren Buffet is a little smarter than T &S.
and owner
11-28-2007, 07:16 PM
#48
Snakes & Nape
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: B-767 Captain
Posts: 775
Roughair:
No, I didn't interview with SATSair and not get hired. I had a very good friend who flew for them for almost a year and finally left. We lived in the same general area. He gave me the information, showed me the contract he signed, explained the training program and let me see his pay stub. I was interested at one time because the concept of living at the base was attractive to me.
Let's set the record straight. I do NOT want SATSair to fail. My buddy wanted prospective employees to know what the flight operation was really like because he felt, as did others, that the company was not straight forward and open in the interview process.
If the truth be known, I hope that SATSair succeedes and that the pilots who elect to fly for them enjoy a long career with them. The rumor mill says that in the last telephone update to employees, the company mentioned international operations. That's great !! I know that they are looking at increasing pilot pay significantly and that's great also. The VLJ's are definately coming and so just about everyone there should be flying jets before too long. Fantastic !! I hope they add a 401-K plan, medical, dental, eye care plans, vacation pay, sick pay, personal leave, maternity leave, extra pay for training, new flight simulators, etc. to the existing benefits. Hey, if it's that good, I'll definately go to work for them !!!
BTW, I like your King Air. Is that a -200 ?
I have two friends who went to work for FedEx when they started and are in the "Dirty 30" (original 30 pilots). While early pilots did put some fuel purchases on personal credit cards, they were reimbursed and the stories about Fred Smith going to Las Vegas to meet payroll have been "greatly exaggerated". Good stories though. I agree with Hrdlndg...not a good analogy.
No, I didn't interview with SATSair and not get hired. I had a very good friend who flew for them for almost a year and finally left. We lived in the same general area. He gave me the information, showed me the contract he signed, explained the training program and let me see his pay stub. I was interested at one time because the concept of living at the base was attractive to me.
Let's set the record straight. I do NOT want SATSair to fail. My buddy wanted prospective employees to know what the flight operation was really like because he felt, as did others, that the company was not straight forward and open in the interview process.
If the truth be known, I hope that SATSair succeedes and that the pilots who elect to fly for them enjoy a long career with them. The rumor mill says that in the last telephone update to employees, the company mentioned international operations. That's great !! I know that they are looking at increasing pilot pay significantly and that's great also. The VLJ's are definately coming and so just about everyone there should be flying jets before too long. Fantastic !! I hope they add a 401-K plan, medical, dental, eye care plans, vacation pay, sick pay, personal leave, maternity leave, extra pay for training, new flight simulators, etc. to the existing benefits. Hey, if it's that good, I'll definately go to work for them !!!
BTW, I like your King Air. Is that a -200 ?
I have two friends who went to work for FedEx when they started and are in the "Dirty 30" (original 30 pilots). While early pilots did put some fuel purchases on personal credit cards, they were reimbursed and the stories about Fred Smith going to Las Vegas to meet payroll have been "greatly exaggerated". Good stories though. I agree with Hrdlndg...not a good analogy.
Last edited by Phantom Flyer; 11-28-2007 at 07:23 PM.
11-29-2007, 06:04 AM
#49
New Hire
Joined APC: Sep 2007
Position: EMB 145 CA
Posts: 7
[quote=roughair;269778]"astute management"? What does that mean?
A quick and dirty balance sheet shows - 20,000 hrs/yr @$500/hr=$10M/yr
Fuel at $5.50/g x 20gph x 20,000 hrs= $2.2M
Salaries+maintenance+payments+etc= ?
Less than $8.8M...surely.
Guess math or accounting were not your majors in college. $10M- 2.2M = $7.8M
A balance sheet contains cash, receivables, payables, fixed assets etc.
Stick to piloting and let the pros handle the business side of aviation.
A quick and dirty balance sheet shows - 20,000 hrs/yr @$500/hr=$10M/yr
Fuel at $5.50/g x 20gph x 20,000 hrs= $2.2M
Salaries+maintenance+payments+etc= ?
Less than $8.8M...surely.
Guess math or accounting were not your majors in college. $10M- 2.2M = $7.8M
A balance sheet contains cash, receivables, payables, fixed assets etc.
Stick to piloting and let the pros handle the business side of aviation.
Last edited by Douglas H; 11-29-2007 at 06:05 AM. Reason: spelling
11-29-2007, 11:39 AM
#50
On Reserve
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Posts: 14
According to hrdlndg aka 68navajo we don't need many planes because we're doing so poorly. (Or was that we work the pilots too hard because we're too busy? I don't know he confuses me.) I'm not going to say what the real number is but it's much lower than 11 down. Several having engines rebuilt right now. Flying alot = engines reaching TBO.
5 Million passenger miles flown first two and a half years ain't too shabby, especially when you consider the first year there were only a handful of planes.
High deadleg rate is expected for a while in an op like this; but has been getting much better. When planes are added, and/or the area is expanded it will go up again for awhile -- the natural growth cycle. I read an article about Netjets taking many years to get their deadleg down to about 35% or so, which is probably about as good as it gets. I think it took them a long time to be profitable and now they're making many $$$$.
Lotsa new customers every month if 68hardlandingsnavajo isn't scaring em all away.
5 Million passenger miles flown first two and a half years ain't too shabby, especially when you consider the first year there were only a handful of planes.
High deadleg rate is expected for a while in an op like this; but has been getting much better. When planes are added, and/or the area is expanded it will go up again for awhile -- the natural growth cycle. I read an article about Netjets taking many years to get their deadleg down to about 35% or so, which is probably about as good as it gets. I think it took them a long time to be profitable and now they're making many $$$$.
Lotsa new customers every month if 68hardlandingsnavajo isn't scaring em all away.
Originally Posted by Phantom Flyer
EJECT !! You're on fire hrdlndg.
Intel says that there are 15 A/C flying, 1 "not on certificate" and 11 down for maintenance. Let's see...that's 44.4% of the total fleet down and NOT available. Not a pretty picture and from what you said was on the phoncon, maybe it is time to bail out.
Where is that life raft on the Cirrus....I DO know where the 'chute is...standby.."Hey Center, this is Aerocab EJECTING !!
Intel says that there are 15 A/C flying, 1 "not on certificate" and 11 down for maintenance. Let's see...that's 44.4% of the total fleet down and NOT available. Not a pretty picture and from what you said was on the phoncon, maybe it is time to bail out.
Where is that life raft on the Cirrus....I DO know where the 'chute is...standby.."Hey Center, this is Aerocab EJECTING !!
Last edited by skydweller97; 11-29-2007 at 01:35 PM.
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