On-Call Is Not Rest
01-10-2010 | 04:54 PM
#101
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2008
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-mini
01-10-2010 | 06:35 PM
#102
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I must break this interpretation often as the manager (and captain) of a one aircraft flight dept.
I can't schedule maintenance, crew training, coordinate with the owner, talk to the FAA or any of that during a rest period? I understand the discussion here is more for line pilots but there are no gray areas right? So next time I'm in a dayroom getting my 10 hours (probably watching TV) I won't answer the phone when our POI calls and wants to discuss the GOM revision we submitted.
Are you guys sucking oxygen above FL350 too? Try that on a 5 hour flight. Regs are regs.
Fly safe.
I can't schedule maintenance, crew training, coordinate with the owner, talk to the FAA or any of that during a rest period? I understand the discussion here is more for line pilots but there are no gray areas right? So next time I'm in a dayroom getting my 10 hours (probably watching TV) I won't answer the phone when our POI calls and wants to discuss the GOM revision we submitted.
Are you guys sucking oxygen above FL350 too? Try that on a 5 hour flight. Regs are regs.
Fly safe.
01-10-2010 | 07:06 PM
#103
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We do. Whoever is PF goes on O2 at 350 on the way up and comes off on the way down.
I know lots of guys don't, but that doesn't make it right.
Integrity is doing the right thing when no one is looking. The feds would never know if we used O2 or not above 350 (or 350/410 on part 91 legs as appropriate - one or two pilots on board at the controls), but that doesn't stop us from doing it.
-mini
I know lots of guys don't, but that doesn't make it right.
Integrity is doing the right thing when no one is looking. The feds would never know if we used O2 or not above 350 (or 350/410 on part 91 legs as appropriate - one or two pilots on board at the controls), but that doesn't stop us from doing it.
-mini
01-10-2010 | 07:37 PM
#104
Line Holder
Joined: Dec 2008
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It must be a strange relationship with your POI if they can assign you flight duty or fire you if you don't answer your phone, but ok.
And who said you have to suck down O2 above 350. Reread the rule. It just has to be secured and sealed. Is that really asking too much considering the risk of rapid decompression?
How do you determine which rules to follow? Just asking an reasonable question , I think.
And who said you have to suck down O2 above 350. Reread the rule. It just has to be secured and sealed. Is that really asking too much considering the risk of rapid decompression?
How do you determine which rules to follow? Just asking an reasonable question , I think.
01-10-2010 | 07:38 PM
#105
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Joined: Aug 2009
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I appreciate your point of view minitour and I'm glad such emphasis is put on doing things 'right' at your outfit. Out of curiosity how large is your department and are you a line pilot?
The O2 issue is getting off topic, it was just an example. I'm not sure it's representative of integrity though.
Maybe if I didn't spend so much time scheduling maintenance, setting up training authorizations for sim school, writing manuals, working on SMS approval & complying with every new FAA mandate I'd have some for some real 'rest'!
In fact, I think I'll give myself some legally mandated rest right now!
The O2 issue is getting off topic, it was just an example. I'm not sure it's representative of integrity though.
Maybe if I didn't spend so much time scheduling maintenance, setting up training authorizations for sim school, writing manuals, working on SMS approval & complying with every new FAA mandate I'd have some for some real 'rest'!
In fact, I think I'll give myself some legally mandated rest right now!
01-10-2010 | 07:44 PM
#106
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From: Capt
Hi!
Legally, during crew rest, you can receive one phone call from your company, and you are not allowed to do ANY company business. A 2nd phone call from the company breaks your rest, and you have to start your 10 hours all over again.
Also, On Call is NOT rest, BUT, according to FAA practices, you can be on call 24/7, and, so, obviously, have 0 rest before a flight. It is not technically LEGAL, but it is allowed by the FAA in actual practice, much like many Part 91companies can fly their plane Part 135 for-hire, as the FAA allows it.
cliff
GRB
Legally, during crew rest, you can receive one phone call from your company, and you are not allowed to do ANY company business. A 2nd phone call from the company breaks your rest, and you have to start your 10 hours all over again.
Also, On Call is NOT rest, BUT, according to FAA practices, you can be on call 24/7, and, so, obviously, have 0 rest before a flight. It is not technically LEGAL, but it is allowed by the FAA in actual practice, much like many Part 91companies can fly their plane Part 135 for-hire, as the FAA allows it.
cliff
GRB
01-10-2010 | 07:46 PM
#107
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Joined: Aug 2009
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Though, if I'm gonna be sleeping in a dayroom my phone will be off.
I'm not sure what aircraft you're flying but we can't turn off the O2 supply to the masks short of opening up the nose and pulling the hose off the bottle.
01-10-2010 | 07:58 PM
#108
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I guess you'd call me a "line pilot"
Maybe if I didn't spend so much time scheduling maintenance, setting up training authorizations for sim school, writing manuals, working on SMS approval & complying with every new FAA mandate I'd have some for some real 'rest'!
-mini
01-10-2010 | 08:00 PM
#109
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2008
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Also, On Call is NOT rest, BUT, according to FAA practices, you can be on call 24/7, and, so, obviously, have 0 rest before a flight. It is not technically LEGAL, but it is allowed by the FAA in actual practice, much like many Part 91companies can fly their plane Part 135 for-hire, as the FAA allows it.
cliff
GRB
cliff
GRB
2) 91 companies flying plane part 135? What? Either you have the operating certificate (excuse me...air carrier certificate) or you don't. If you know of an operator doing a "134.5" thing, you really should be making a phone call. It protects those of us on legitimate certificates. There's considerable expense and time involved in obtaining and maintaining a legitimate air carrier certificate and those that feel they're above the rules regarding air carriers can kiss my big toe. If you won't make the call, I'll be happy to.
-mini
01-10-2010 | 08:49 PM
#110
Line Holder
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,262
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From: Trying not to crash
Very interesting discussion. Can this problem be fixed from within the FAA- As in, some of us get jobs as Inspectors, and focus on violating companies as opposed to pilots? Or at least, in addition to the pilots? What I've got from this conversation is the only way for me to help (aside from standing my ground as a pilot, and calling the FAA) is to get a job at the FAA, and try to make a change from there. And I get the feeling that your fellow FAA inspectors won't like that too much, seeing as to how they have overlooked this for years.
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