beech1980

Flying the ILS or another instrument approach would've saved the Atlas and Southwest pilots a lot of carpet dances.... Nothing wrong with being safe. You Sir sound like a real Maverick.
All the OP was asking was for advice. Not to be told he/she was a rook. The Captain needs to stand up and take responsibility for his actions. It was unfortunate that you had to take the brunt of the passengers issues.

mia389

The Citation XL I fly we can mute all the avionics from the speakers. I have always been strait up with the passengers. I would of told them the captain flew the approach a little low so the plane was warning us.

Passengers can tell when your bull****ting them. This isn't their first rodeo. Put yourself in their shoes. They are flying along and hear all kinds of warnings. The pilots keep looking back at them making funny gestures about their ears. On approach they keep hearing more warnings. Your passenger was asking you a rhetorical question really.

If the captain did not want the passengers to be asking he shouldn't have flown below the GS. Surely he knew flying low would of alerted the passengers. Same could be said for the overspeed clacker.

From what you wrote it seems you are flying with a great guy. (sarcastic) He flys fast, low and then wants you to cover for him. Also doesn't want his SIC talking to passengers. I would get some time and get out of there haha.

Dealing with passengers is one of the hardest part of 91/135 flying. I miss the cabin door we had in the 121 world. In part 91 the passengers can make it a good company or a bad.

Aviator89

I have had this similar situation. people hear CAS messages or see them on the G1000 and they ask questions. I be honest with them, but make sure to not make it sound dangerous. For example, the fuel quantity caution goes off with 1 hour of fuel left so almost every flight it goes off near landing. I just tell them its an overactive safety system, and we actually have an hour worth of fuel left. perfectly safe.
At the same time I have gotten "in trouble" with the boss both by being honest with passengers, and deceiving when needed to hide actual dangers/failures that occur. Such as nearby traffic, bad icing, autopilot failures etc. (like i was instructed to do in the first place) Just part of the job when the boss doesnt know **** about flying, and passengers complain to him not me. Even if I do my job as he says, if a passenger complains, even if its about something out of my control he finds away to make it sound like it was my fault. For example, 7am departure, 8am ETA. PAX shows up at 7:05, wheels up by 7;15 and so we arrive at 8:15. Guess what? I get a call, asking why I was 15 minutes late. haha, well the PAX showed up at the time we were supposed to be off the ground and 20 minutes after he was instructed to be there.... But somehow this is still my fault. Lol one part of the job I will not miss when I leave 91/135 PAX flying. Once again, ignore the ignorant comments from PAX and boss and move on.

When there are problems with the aircraft I apologize and tell them it will be fixed by next time. If you boss gets mad that they were upset over the aircraft having issues. Well, then too ****ing bad. Its his aircraft right? Faulty epuiment isnt your fault, you handled the situation fine. As for your captain, dont feed his ego by letting him do all the work.
On a side note, why was he repeatedly low on the glide-slope to set off warnings a few times anyway? Shouldn't be captain if you cant fly a ******* approach without setting off warnings.
As for the PAX not liking turbulence. haha, well tough **** sherlock. You chose to fly, turbulence happens. If you sit in a rough flight level then yeah maybe you could get flack for that, but come on really? I hate it when people complain about turbulence, and when aviation bosses are upset with pilots for flying in it. Thats like telling a boat captain to never go in wavy water, but still cross an ocean. haha what a joke. Just ignore those dumbass comments from PAX, and avoid known areas of turbulence. There is nothing more you can do.

CFI Guy

I gave him the heads up he wasn't going to meet the altitude on the crossing restriction by my calculations. He then proceeded to idle the power and really increase the descent rate causing the over speed. He was already at redline and was aware of that fact so I couldn't really say anything in time. I think he was more concerned about being too high.

I pay attention believe me. But the standard operating procedure for some of the captains is to pop the overspeed warning CB when they get in...

wmuflyboy

Ok well thats good. I know you are new and was just offering a suggestion.

As far as pulling CBs - I dont know how I feel about that. Theres really no reason for it unless overspeeding is a consistent thing for your airplane. A simple call to ATC will almost always rectify that crossing restriction situation and they rarely get mad. But thats just my experience.

I also think its crappy that your Captain puts you in any situation like yhat. Whether its exceeding the limitatons of the aircraft so horns are screaming or dealing with Mr. Stern type pax.

TonyC

The problem is clear to me. The captain.

The next time you should simply say, "The captain doesn't like me to talk about his inadequacies -- you'll have to ask the captain."




Those aural warnings are there for a reason -- they're not just nuisances. Make the captain fix the condition that triggers the warning.






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TonyC

If you can't fly the glideslope and land in the remaining runway, you have no business going there.


I love listening to macho men heroes, they have no common sense. We read about them in NTSB reports.






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mojo6911

What? How about slowing it down? Don't you have speed brakes?

maddogmax

The crew of NWA 255 pulled the takeoff warning CB so it wouldn't go off on the ground while they were taxiing single engine at high power. They took off with flaps up and killed all but one baby. Those warnings are there for a reason. Usually a deadly one!

Packrat

Love it! Wish I still flew pax as an F/O so I could use it. LOL!