ExpressJet and Chautauqua, and timing
10-15-2005, 10:13 AM
#11
Self Employed.
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: Corporate Pilot
Posts: 7,119
Hard Road
TPP,
You could take the hard road and end up sour and mean like some of us. You could also try to buy a job and end up with nothing in the end. You might pass on marriage and wake up one day fat, 40 and alone. There is risk in every path but the one that is the riskiest of all is doing nothing. We all have to put our money down and see where the cards take us.
The world belongs to those who take risk. However, it hurts really bad if it doesnt work out so have a few back up plans too.
SkyHigh
You could take the hard road and end up sour and mean like some of us. You could also try to buy a job and end up with nothing in the end. You might pass on marriage and wake up one day fat, 40 and alone. There is risk in every path but the one that is the riskiest of all is doing nothing. We all have to put our money down and see where the cards take us.
The world belongs to those who take risk. However, it hurts really bad if it doesnt work out so have a few back up plans too.
SkyHigh
10-15-2005, 10:29 AM
#12
Self Employed.
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: Corporate Pilot
Posts: 7,119
Warning
Originally Posted by warning
And you are not a professional if you don't acare about the $$ you will be making. This is my profession, don't bring me down to your level because you don't care about being able to support yourself with dignity.
Wow ! Warning !,
Hey I'm supposed to be the dark and negative guy here. Where did you come from? Besides the term you are looking for is "working hobby". People who don't care about the income side of aviation to me are considered to be those who are trying to reduce our industry into a working hobby.
Didn't you hear that we are all supposed to do the job simply for the love of aviation? It is shameful to suggest otherwise. Why the thought of having monetary desires associated with a career in aviation is preposterous. We are all supposed to be monks of the sky living humble and modest lives thankful every day for another opportunity to accomplish another originating check list.
SkyHigh
10-15-2005, 11:24 AM
#13
Guest
Posts: n/a
Originally Posted by TheProfessionalPilot
<snip>
I dont CARE about hourly pay.... I care about where I live and as long as I am going to get Capt. when I turn 23,
<snip>
Best Regards,
Jason Leonard
A guy who wants to do it RIGHT.
For a guy who wants to do it RIGHT, you really are considering doing all of the things that are WRONG.
Paying for training and experience that will get you an airline job is WRONG.
Only being worried about PIC time is WRONG. You should get paid a fair wage for the work that you do. The market determines what that is, but right now there are too many that think that "just getting the foot in the door" will help out your career prospects. The problem is that too many people think that way now, and the career is dying.
10-15-2005, 01:07 PM
#14
Self Employed.
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: Corporate Pilot
Posts: 7,119
Spamman
Spamman,
Yea but everyone knows that the regionals are just a stepping stone. The only real money is in the big leagues, so who cares about CRJ pay? The only thing that matters is minimizing the pain. 10K extra per year is nothing compared to a fast upgrade. Getting to the left seat is the only thing that will get you out of that hell hole. I wouldn't have taken 15K/year more if it meant a 3 month upgrade delay. The dude is right. The regionals never were meant to be a career. Management wants you to leave. That is why they are so nonchalant about abusing the workers. Get in get the time and get out as fast as possible.
SkyHigh
Yea but everyone knows that the regionals are just a stepping stone. The only real money is in the big leagues, so who cares about CRJ pay? The only thing that matters is minimizing the pain. 10K extra per year is nothing compared to a fast upgrade. Getting to the left seat is the only thing that will get you out of that hell hole. I wouldn't have taken 15K/year more if it meant a 3 month upgrade delay. The dude is right. The regionals never were meant to be a career. Management wants you to leave. That is why they are so nonchalant about abusing the workers. Get in get the time and get out as fast as possible.
SkyHigh
10-15-2005, 01:30 PM
#15
Guest
Posts: n/a
^^^^Let the stranger take this one...
A stepping stone? Since when.....not since about September of 2001. That's the shortsightedness that has ruined the entire biz. Don't you see that these "regional jets" are now the size of 737s and DC9s!? And management has got people flying them for a little over $30/hour. Now the mainline carriers can funnel money to their feeders and get them to cover the larger (and continually larger) domestic markets for a FRACTION of the cost(labor wise), utilizing the CR9s and E190s. Now the "regional jet" that you fly at your "regional airline" is keeping you around longer and management is laughing about it. You know why? Because quick fix idiots like this guy just wanted to get out in a hurry. And he fell for it. We should never have allowed anything larger than 70 seats @ the "regional" level. It only serves a subversive end.
So there goes the 'stepping stone' argument. PFTers and others like you have ruined the ENTIRE industry. We used to think that you just made the regionals suck, but mainlines all over the country have seen what you'll do when they begin to lube up. Congratulations: you're the horse that management's riding in the race to the bottom, and you're winning.
Freaking hack.
So there goes the 'stepping stone' argument. PFTers and others like you have ruined the ENTIRE industry. We used to think that you just made the regionals suck, but mainlines all over the country have seen what you'll do when they begin to lube up. Congratulations: you're the horse that management's riding in the race to the bottom, and you're winning.
Freaking hack.
Last edited by warning; 10-15-2005 at 01:33 PM.
10-15-2005, 02:11 PM
#16
Self Employed.
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: Corporate Pilot
Posts: 7,119
Oh Man !!!
Warning,
I don't even know where to begin. I wish I had more time. Perhaps you are holding on to tight to something that was never meant to be. The regionals never were meant to be a career. Management knows it and so do most pilots. The pay is low and working conditions are bad and that is for a reason. They don't want you to get to comfortable. For a brief time Comair won a place in the sun (just Barely), but now it is gone. The pilots at DAL and NWA want the RJ's and as many surmise the age of the regional airline as a growing force are coming to an end. If you can't convert your time at a regional into a job at a good company then its over. Your time is up. If you stay then you are going to have to accept an impoverished and over worked life. You have no support. Irregardless of seat per mile earnings and feeder arguments. You will find just as many big plane drivers that will tell you just the opposite. It is all meaningless and there will never be unity among regional pilots because to the majority it just a stepping stone. They just want to upgrade quickly and have their shot at the big time. The kid is smart. Get in and get out. Upgrade is everything.
SkyHigh
I don't even know where to begin. I wish I had more time. Perhaps you are holding on to tight to something that was never meant to be. The regionals never were meant to be a career. Management knows it and so do most pilots. The pay is low and working conditions are bad and that is for a reason. They don't want you to get to comfortable. For a brief time Comair won a place in the sun (just Barely), but now it is gone. The pilots at DAL and NWA want the RJ's and as many surmise the age of the regional airline as a growing force are coming to an end. If you can't convert your time at a regional into a job at a good company then its over. Your time is up. If you stay then you are going to have to accept an impoverished and over worked life. You have no support. Irregardless of seat per mile earnings and feeder arguments. You will find just as many big plane drivers that will tell you just the opposite. It is all meaningless and there will never be unity among regional pilots because to the majority it just a stepping stone. They just want to upgrade quickly and have their shot at the big time. The kid is smart. Get in and get out. Upgrade is everything.
SkyHigh
10-15-2005, 02:21 PM
#18
Guest
Posts: n/a
Irregardless? Try going back to the 3rd grade. That ain't even a word.
The argument is this and it's the point you missed.... the regionals are no longer the stepping stone that YOU'RE holding on to. Especially as they get bigger and bigger equipment. End of story.
Upgrades and all of that aside.
The argument is this and it's the point you missed.... the regionals are no longer the stepping stone that YOU'RE holding on to. Especially as they get bigger and bigger equipment. End of story.
Upgrades and all of that aside.
10-15-2005, 02:24 PM
#19
Guest
Posts: n/a
Originally Posted by SkyHigh
Spamman,
Yea but everyone knows that the regionals are just a stepping stone. The only real money is in the big leagues, so who cares about CRJ pay? The only thing that matters is minimizing the pain. 10K extra per year is nothing compared to a fast upgrade. Getting to the left seat is the only thing that will get you out of that hell hole. I wouldn't have taken 15K/year more if it meant a 3 month upgrade delay. The dude is right. The regionals never were meant to be a career. Management wants you to leave. That is why they are so nonchalant about abusing the workers. Get in get the time and get out as fast as possible.
SkyHigh
Yea but everyone knows that the regionals are just a stepping stone. The only real money is in the big leagues, so who cares about CRJ pay? The only thing that matters is minimizing the pain. 10K extra per year is nothing compared to a fast upgrade. Getting to the left seat is the only thing that will get you out of that hell hole. I wouldn't have taken 15K/year more if it meant a 3 month upgrade delay. The dude is right. The regionals never were meant to be a career. Management wants you to leave. That is why they are so nonchalant about abusing the workers. Get in get the time and get out as fast as possible.
SkyHigh
10-15-2005, 03:10 PM
#20
Chief Jeppesen Updater
Joined APC: Oct 2005
Position: Executive Transport Driver
Posts: 3,080
Hey skyhigh! How about this? We could all apply to SWA and JetBlue. We don't want to work for the pay they make now... we're willing to do it for $40K/year less since after all it is flying the "Big Iron" and hey... it's only a stepping stone to the 747/777/A340/A380.
You're arguement is why 1/3 of the pilots in this country QUALIFY FOR FOOD STAMPS AND SHARE HOMES WITH 5 OTHER PILOTS!!!
Wake up and smell the coffee dude! Where does the cycle end? How about flight instructors work for free? (After all they are only building time- it's a stepping stone.) I have an idea... let's not pay first officers either. They can pay their dues in the right seat. And captains at a regional... nah... they shouldn't be making what they do. It's a stepping stone.
Good luck finding that job at a "major". Last I checked, most of them were in BK and furloughing...
You're arguement is why 1/3 of the pilots in this country QUALIFY FOR FOOD STAMPS AND SHARE HOMES WITH 5 OTHER PILOTS!!!
Wake up and smell the coffee dude! Where does the cycle end? How about flight instructors work for free? (After all they are only building time- it's a stepping stone.) I have an idea... let's not pay first officers either. They can pay their dues in the right seat. And captains at a regional... nah... they shouldn't be making what they do. It's a stepping stone.
Good luck finding that job at a "major". Last I checked, most of them were in BK and furloughing...
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