Regionals
 

Well you have the IBT Airline Division and Bedford at the very least to thank for that. If Skywest management did anything you can thank them too.


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Yep, sure have and I still made more as corporate pilot than the regional's during those periods of downturn. Your last comment is nonsensical. So you think management wants 9/11 and recessions? Bankruptcy and consolidation are normally occurring functions of business and they can have negative ramifications on management employees as well. Management and business are just as powerless as unions to prevent 9/11 and recessions. All of these events would have occurred whether or not unions are present.

I get it, you are happy to have the collective control your career and you embrace tenure, mediocrity, and seniority as a governance as apposed to idividual talent and the free market. In a union shop 25 + years of experience is worth just a much as first year FO. Just as seniority dictates who gets the highest paying job as opposed to experince or talent. Sure you can use the argument that training will washout the unfit pilot, but what a waste of money and efficiency.

I do think unions serve a purpose when it comes to the promotion of safety, work rules, and the representation of a pilots that run afoul of company policy or regulations or medical issues. As well, I believe union involvement in the labor force of the past help to establish the middle class, but now they seem out of date and ineffective in private industry.

But please enlighten me on my lack of knowledge about unions, because your last comment really has shown me the depth of your knowledge.

Good points, and I agree with you that a conflict of interest exists when it comes to both ALPA's representation of both mainline and the regionals. I just feel that unions are outdated and have not evolved as both business and society has. Unions have in the past played an effective role when representing the labor force, but the gains made in aviation, regionals in particular have been miniscule.

These up and coming generations may or may not embrace the union presence in this industry and may elect not to participate. We shall see, but one thing is for sure the retirement wave is about to hit and weather or not they are able to make it beneficial to this next generation is yet to be determined. I think the supply of pilots in the market will be the greater determinate of pay and QOL than any weight unions may bring to bear on the industry.

Lot of inertia in the airline union establishment, including the regionals, I doubt the noobs are going to bother overturning the cart while on their fast-track to the majors.

Very few people at the majors would give up a union, most know how that would play out. Some are frustrated with politics, corruption, and might want a regime change or new union but nobody in their right mind wants to decertify... we make too much money to roll the dice on it.

I remember being on the JetBlue jumpseat multiple times years ago and they always said that ALPA would never be voted in. Now look at what has happened. One way or the other most pilots want the union at the end of the day.

Very true, poor statement and observation on my part with regard to the majors. The unions at the regional level will never function much to the benefit of the pilot as long as there is rapid upward movement(hence nobody gives a sh!t, I'm outta here soon), or in times of stagnation and trying to negotiate during a poor economy. The regionals by default are designed to be outsourced cheap labor, and gave rise due to unions relaxing scope to the advantage of the few at the top.

I guess my original point is what the industry would look like absent the unions. My personal opinion is that it would be much better for the pilot. Certainly there would be negatives, like those you have outlined previously, but I think overall the free market would be much more advantageous to the pilot.

It would look like SkyWest, which is pretty much the same as the union airlines, and still paid by years of service and hours worked and nothing else.

It would look like SkyWest, which is pretty much the same as the union airlines, and still paid by years of service and hours worked and nothing else.

Unchecked crony capitalism is rarely beneficial to the average worker.

Skywest might look quite different if the industry precedents did not exist. All the regionals, as they grew, evolved labor business models based on the existing major airlines.

Please explain how you track talent and individual worth in a 5000 to 15000 pilot airline. Seniority IS how you award experience. If you were so much better off in the corporate world it seems you are a poor decision maker.