Way too many seem to latch on this foolish theory that somehow scrapping the ATP requirement, would lead to better more capable applicants early on. As if to suggest that there are countless of these 250 Hr Hotshots, who quit and go into Medicine, Tech or Finance right after their commercial check ride.......and its only the WEAK WHO SURVIVE and make it to 1500, and all the while diminishing their craft the more hours they get. WHAT NONSENSE!

I mean wasn't the old system so fair, just and meritocratic.........we all know Pre ATP requirement to best chance get to the regionals you needed at least one of the following hopefully all three: 1. Dad/Family at legacy. 2.Money to buy additional "Multi time" to be more competitive 3. No Family to support so you could afford to take a job that paid 18.50 per hour.....I mean WHY NOT BRO.

Neither one of those things involves Airmanship, Knowledge or Aeronautical decision making.
The ATP requirement was the most meritocratic thing introduced to an industry where it usually is lacking. For community college guys like myself, now we either have 1500 or we don't, and if we don't the ways to get it are very transparent and accessible. It doesn't matter what race you are, who your Father is, what your credit rating is.....you either HAVE IT OR YOU DON'T.

 

keep putting those apps in. That phone call will happen one day, little buddy.

 

Doublespeak. If the requirement isn't about hours, then why is there an hour requirement, for most pilots at 1500?

 

There also is a requirement to be of good moral character. A few clicks through this great website would suggest there are many fraudulent ATP certificates out there.

 

14 CFR 121.436(a)(1) establishes a requirement for the PIC and SIC to hold an airline transport pilot certificate. Nowhere in the regulation is a stipulation found that requires 1,500 hours to serve as SIC under Part 121. Only that the SIC hold an ATP pilot certificate that is not subject to the limitations of 14 CFR 61.167.

In turn, 14 CFR 61.167(b) stipulates that the holder of an ATP certificate who has not met the age or experience requirements of 61.153(a)(1) and 61.159 bears certain limitations regarding acting as PIC, and in acting as SIC in certain crew compliments.

Nowhere in Part 121 is a stipulation found dictating that the SIC must hold 1,500 hours. Only an ATP. The experience requirements for the ATP have various levels, depending on the means used to meet the regulation. 1,500 hours is mitigated by various other experience and qualification, and is not a hard and fast number. The requirement of 1,500 hours for the ATP has been around a very long time, and well predates Colgan.

The means of understanding the regulation are threefold: first is the preamble to the federal register in which the final rule was announced; second is the FAA Chief Counsel legal interpretation of the regulation, and last is the regulation itself. One who wishes to understand the reasoning of the more recent changes to the ATP experience requirements, including provisions for military pilots and other means of meeting the ATP experience requirements, would do well to read the Federal Register preambles before pontificating about that which (s)he does not understand.

https://www.federalregister.gov/docu...ools-and-other

https://www.federalregister.gov/docu...ier-operations

Additionally, the change to Part 121 itself, establishing the requirement for the ATP for SIC's operating under that part, also has a preamble with legal explanation of the rationale for the regulation. Read it:

https://www.federalregister.gov/docu...ical-amendment

Nowhere in that preamble is a requirement established for a SIC in Part 121 operations to have 1,500 hours. The requirement for the SIC to hold an ATP certificate IS established, however, along with all the rationale for the change, and the rationale establishing that a PIC must have 1,000 hours in air transport service.

If one continues to beat one's empty noggin on the stairs and insist that it's a 1,500 hour rule, it's a clarion call that directs all present to look to the stupid person, banging his head on the steps. Clue in, brightspark. Banging your head or parroting the same, tired lies and misinformation, won't make you any smarter.

 

It’s not double speak. The FAA believes that going through a structured training program, either military or college, will provide the same knowledge base and experience at a lower total time than just cruising around for 1500 hours. It’s up to the person to figure out which path to the ATP they want to take.

 

Yes. The rule is that you must have an ATP to be an Air Transport Pilot. It's not a "1500 hour rule", and you don't always need 1500 hours to hold an ATP.

If you think airline pilots shouldn't have an ATP, then come out and say so.

 

Too bad the idiot who wrote that article doesn’t know what the fark he’s talking about.

 

this is nonsensical

 

personally believe there’s needs to be some adjustments to those programs. There’s plenty of 141 hot shots who think they know everything yet can’t manage to go into a new airport on their own because their program kept them in a bubble. The “knowledge” they gain from a degree in aviation isn’t any more valuable than the skills a person learns by getting any other degree. The ability to learn, study, research etc. Military is a topic I won’t touch but I don’t think military experience tops any other experience to justify cutting that time in half. Point is there’s people who come to the 121 world with an ratp that really struggle, despite having had those structured programs and there’s ones that do very well. Just like any other regular 1500hr cfi. There’s no evidence that the structured programs really do much to strengthen a candidates chance of success in 121.

i could get behind 1 ratp level at 1 set of hours if you meet various other qualification or experience requirements. I think having any degree is just as equivalent to having a degree in aviation.