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Old 06-11-2008, 01:00 PM   #21  
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Originally Posted by flyerfly View Post
What is the deal with Skywest weights?!?!? In 2 years and 2 companies I have never turned down a jumpseater due to w&b. Weight restrictions on PPWRK mean nothing either they are just a starting point you can always play with fuel and taxi fuel.

I understand that some gate agents wont allow more people than what is on the ppwrk but I've been turned down after passing the gate agent and introducing myself in the cockpit...

I've done some creative things to get people to/from work just because I don't want to leave them behind.

I've been denied the J/S on skywest 4 times in the approx. past 6 months. Even Mesa always tries to work the weights to get me on. I'm not saying every time I try to get on SKW it doesnt work but more SKW than PNCL, EAGLE, XJ, and MESA. Those are just the Regionals I fly on to get home.

I do enjoy the SKW crews when I do ride and they always treat me well but there are a few of your capts in ord that really could give a crap and its too bad. I know my company has it's share of jerks also.

I am curious though; why can't SKW play with its weights? We do ours on ACARS too just not the Collins software.

Yep, every time somebody bags on us for still using a "whiz wheel" and calculator to do W/B, I think of how many people we've gotten to/from work by being able to adjust numbers that "software" probably wouldn't let us...
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Old 06-11-2008, 02:13 PM   #22  
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Originally Posted by flyerfly View Post
What is the deal with Skywest weights?!?!? In 2 years and 2 companies I have never turned down a jumpseater due to w&b. Weight restrictions on PPWRK mean nothing either they are just a starting point you can always play with fuel and taxi fuel....

I am curious though; why can't SKW play with its weights? We do ours on ACARS too just not the Collins software.
I've been denied the jumpseat *many* more times on ERJ's than on Skywest's CRJ's.

In two years of flying the thing I've never had to deny someone, so you must be having really bad luck. It has happened to me occasionally with a combination of a distant alternate, a lot of holding fuel, and a forward empty CG. In that case, there's literally nothing we can do to get you on. We work just as hard as anyone to accommodate jumpseaters, but you can only fudge fuel so much and still be legal...and ACARS doesn't let you lie very much.
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Old 06-11-2008, 02:18 PM   #23  
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I will try to clear a few things up here.........

first the jumpseat is "owned" by the FAA. next comes the company ownership, if they want to give the captain ALL authority then that is up to them, but that was a company decision. At skywest management wants a reciprocal agreement before it goes to the third in line.......the captain. Once it passes the first two it now becomes the captains authority to deny or allow the jumpseater. If you meet the requirements of cockpit access (electronic verification CASS or internally for "online" and "codeshare" pilots, then you may ride in the cockpit.

Now let's clear up what CASS is and what it is not.............

CASS requires each individual airline to input a CASS carrier code into their computer so that the agents can look you up. If you do not have an agreement with that carrier the agents can input your two letter code all day long and it will not recognize it. At skywest on the UAX side (which is what SMX would have been to LAX) we are subjected to the limitations of UAL's computer system, so in this case if the agent was attempting to use CASS and you do not have a CASS agreement with UAL you cannot get verified. Having said that there is a mechanism in the system to allow agents to look up skywests agreement list which would allow you to get a cabin seat only. So just because you are a CASS airline does not mean you can automatically jumpseat in the cockpit of any CASS carrier.

As to Ameriflight..........you are not CASS. Ameriflight sells a subprogram that LOOKS like CASS but in fact is not a true CASS agreement through ARINC. In fact here is the latest list from ARINC dated June 4th 2008 ,,,,,,,,No Ameriflight:

ABX Air (GB)
Airnet Systems (USC)
AirTran (FL)
Air Cargo Carriers (2Q)
Air Midwest (ZV)
Air Transport International (8C)
Air Wisconsin (ZW)
Alaska Air (AS)
Allegiant Air (G4)
Aloha (AQ)
America West (HP)
American (AA)
American Eagle (AA)
Ameristar (AJI)
Arctic Transportation Services (7S)
Arrow Cargo (JW)
ASTAR Air Cargo (ER)
Atlantic Southeast (EV)
Atlas Air (5Y)
Aviation Services Ltd dba Freedom Air (FP)
Bering Air (8E)
Cape Air (9K)
Capital Cargo International (PT)
Champion Air (MG)
Chautauqua Airlines (RP)
Colgan Air (9L)
Comair (OH)
Commutair (C5)
Compass Airlines (CP)
Continental Airlines (CO)
Delta (DL)
Empire (EM)
Eos Airlines (E0)
Evergreen Airlines (EZ)
Everts Air (3Z)
Executive (AA) is American Eagle's SJU Operation
Expressjet / Continental Express (XE)
FedEx (FX)
Florida West International Airways(RF)
Freedom Airlines (F8)
Frontier (F9)
Gemini Air Cargo (GR)
GoJet Airlines (G7)
Great Lakes Aviation (ZK)
Hageland Aviation (H6)
Hawaiian Airlines (HA)
Horizon Air (QX)
IFL Group (IF)
Island Air (WP)
JetBlue (B6)
Kalitta Air (K4)
Kalitta Charters II (CB)
Kalitta Charters LLC (KFS)
Key Lime Air (KG)
Lynden Air Cargo (L2)
Lynx Aviation (L4)
Mesa Airlines (YV)
Mesaba (XJ)
Midwest Airlines (YX)
Murray Air (5M)
North American Airlines (NA)
Northern Air Cargo (NC)
Northwest (NW)
Omni Air International (OY)
Pace Airlines (Y5)
PenAir (KS)
Piedmont Airlines (US)
Pinnacle (9E)
Polar Air Cargo (PO)
Primaris (FE)
PSA Airlines (US)
Republic Airlines (RP)
Ryan International (RD)
Shuttle America (RP)
Skyway Enterprises (KI)
SkyWest(OO)
Southwest (WN)
Spirit Air (NK)
Sun Country Airlines (SY)
Swift Air (Q7)
Tradewinds Airlines (WI)
Trans North Aviation (7T)
Trans States Airlines (AX)
United (UA)
USA 3000 (U5)
USA Jet Airlines (JUS)
UPS Airlines (5X)
US Airways (US)
Virgin America (VX)
World Airways (WO)
Xtra Airways (XP)
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Old 06-12-2008, 03:49 PM   #24  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyerfly View Post
What is the deal with Skywest weights?!?!? In 2 years and 2 companies I have never turned down a jumpseater due to w&b. Weight restrictions on PPWRK mean nothing either they are just a starting point you can always play with fuel and taxi fuel.

I understand that some gate agents wont allow more people than what is on the ppwrk but I've been turned down after passing the gate agent and introducing myself in the cockpit...

I've done some creative things to get people to/from work just because I don't want to leave them behind.

I've been denied the J/S on skywest 4 times in the approx. past 6 months. Even Mesa always tries to work the weights to get me on. I'm not saying every time I try to get on SKW it doesnt work but more SKW than PNCL, EAGLE, XJ, and MESA. Those are just the Regionals I fly on to get home.

I do enjoy the SKW crews when I do ride and they always treat me well but there are a few of your capts in ord that really could give a crap and its too bad. I know my company has it's share of jerks also.

I am curious though; why can't SKW play with its weights? We do ours on ACARS too just not the Collins software.
How can you fudge Zero fuel weight? You are either under it, at it, over it. I know on the west coast everything is done to accomodate j/s folks at OO including moving bags into the cabin that are green tagged. If someone knows a trick please share.
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Old 06-12-2008, 04:17 PM   #25  
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SKW crews will generally make every effort to get JSer on board (we may have a few bad apples like any other airline). But the vast majority of our airplanes have acars, and you cannot fudge the ZFW with acars.

It's illegal to go if acars does not match the ramp's pax/bag count.

Often the problem is CG...the JSer throws the CG too far forward, but you can't add 400 lbs in the back for balance due to ZFW.
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Old 06-12-2008, 05:45 PM   #26  
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I can't remember an instance of where we ran up on max zero fuel weight, because 9 times out of ten we run into problems with the max landing weight. This is simple. Either the captain is comfortable in being more liberal with the fuel number or he/she's not.

As a general rule, if the captain of the flight is a commuter himself, he will be more willing to help out.
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Old 06-12-2008, 05:51 PM   #27  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyerfly View Post
What is the deal with Skywest weights?!?!? In 2 years and 2 companies I have never turned down a jumpseater due to w&b. Weight restrictions on PPWRK mean nothing either they are just a starting point you can always play with fuel and taxi fuel.

I understand that some gate agents wont allow more people than what is on the ppwrk but I've been turned down after passing the gate agent and introducing myself in the cockpit...

I've done some creative things to get people to/from work just because I don't want to leave them behind.

I've been denied the J/S on skywest 4 times in the approx. past 6 months. Even Mesa always tries to work the weights to get me on. I'm not saying every time I try to get on SKW it doesnt work but more SKW than PNCL, EAGLE, XJ, and MESA. Those are just the Regionals I fly on to get home.

I do enjoy the SKW crews when I do ride and they always treat me well but there are a few of your capts in ord that really could give a crap and its too bad. I know my company has it's share of jerks also.

I am curious though; why can't SKW play with its weights? We do ours on ACARS too just not the Collins software.
Just your luck that ORD is a junior base, my friend! Unfortunately there are a few guys there (at least that I know of), that never should have taken that 14 month upgrade...come to think of it, they never should have gotten their Pilot cert's...Hmm...

But anyway, best of luck as always
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Old 06-12-2008, 08:34 PM   #28  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyer2000 View Post
first the jumpseat is "owned" by the FAA. next comes the company ownership, if they want to give the captain ALL authority then that is up to them, but that was a company decision. At skywest management wants a reciprocal agreement before it goes to the third in line.......the captain.
I know at union carriers the jumpseat is something that is negotiated between the company and the union. I would guess this is why probably most of them allow even non-reciprocal or non-CASS people to jumpseat although at the lowest priority.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyer2000 View Post
If you do not have an agreement with that carrier the agents can input your two letter code all day long and it will not recognize it...So just because you are a CASS airline does not mean you can automatically jumpseat in the cockpit of any CASS carrier.
From personal experience, I don't think that is true. I've always seen people that are in CASS be able to jumpseat regardless of whether we had a reciprical agreement with them.
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Old 06-12-2008, 08:42 PM   #29  
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::edit:: reply was a little bit harsh...
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Old 06-13-2008, 05:06 AM   #30  
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From personal experience, I don't think that is true. I've always seen people that are in CASS be able to jumpseat regardless of whether we had a reciprical agreement with them.
I guarantee you someone at your company is taking the list sent from ARINC and inputting each new code (airline). So even if your company does not have an "agreement" if your "policy" is to take all CASS carriers then they are input in the system. Not sure who you work for, but if it is a regional, you are probably "piggy backing" on your mainline carriers CASS, so it is possible that your carrier does not have an agreement with an airline, but the mainline company does......thus you see the CASS query come back approved even if you do not have an agreement. I know each carrier is required to have their own software system to operate CASS. These systems are not linked to automatically update when another carrier becomes CASS. This is why ARINC sends out a list whenever there is a change. The list I posted above was sento out because one airline had become CASS (Aviation Services Ltd dba Freedom Air (FP).

The point was that the original complaint stated that Ameriflight was CASS (they are not) and therefore this pilot should be allowed to speak with the captain.....................both statements were flawed.
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