piper338

Anyone see this new FIL about calculating landing distance for emergencies?

Just wanted to get your thoughts on it.... do we not have a enough to do when the sh*$ hits the fan? Now we gotta pull out a calculator and do all that crap.

FixTheMess

I agree, and I also think we all can agree, the training department doesn't care. If they wanted to make a useful change, they would have left the "worst case scenario" numbers, and added an asterisk, referring to a chart to further refine that number if WE deem it necessary.

Also, all the caution light combinations were taken out of the index. That used to be extremely useful for finding the correct checklist for an electrical problem. Please. Jay. Andy. You and the instructors don't always know best. I think it is reasonable that you consult the pilot group a little before these changes. We have a lot of bright people out on the line.

Piedmonster

The last thing I'd ever do in my life would be to defend that bunch of _____ (insert your own favorite word here).

But it could be an FAA thing. I know it's just a Turbojet thing in the SFAO, but... the FAA’s Safety Alert for Operators (SAFO) 06012, Landing Performance Assessments at Time of Arrival, calls for operators of turbojet
aircraft to develop procedures for flight crews to assess landing
performance based on conditions actually existing at the time of
arrival, compared to conditions presumed and planned for at time
of dispatch. These conditions include weather, runway conditions,
aircraft weight, required and available landing distances, and braking systems to be used.
We now have to do this every flight prior to landing.

That just came out in a company email here at SKW.

So maybe there is some push from the BWI POI to at least include it in emergency situations. I have no idea, but just in case.

Please by all means keep bashing them, especially if it has no link.

OneEye

The training department did not have any role in this other than writing the FIL as directed. Most instructors I know saw nothing wrong with the way it was. As stated in another post, I'm sure the FAA had something to say about it.

FixTheMess

The FAA mandated how we format the index in our QRH? No. They want us to calculate exact numbers for landing when our engine is on fire. Maybe. Could the training department incorporate this along with keeping "worst case scenario" numbers for reference? Yes. Our "QUICK REFERENCE HANDBOOK" is becoming not so quick reference anymore.

This whole thing is FUBAR. If I have plenty of time to calculate pressure altitude, runway slope, runway contamination, wind component, inop equipment penalties, and icing penalties for landing, I probably have time to land at a quite suitable airport that has a long runway. If I am under such time constraints that I may have to land at a less suitable short runway, I most likely will only have time to consult a published number, or maybe I won't have time at all. Bottom line, if this is how its going to be, dispatch should be studying the FIL, because this should be their job using a computer, while we are busy dealing with the emergency. Our capabilities in the cockpit, when the sh*$ hits the fan is finite. We do not have the automation nor the support from dispatch that other airlines have.

gijoe411

Oh, this is going to be fun...

*Engine Shut down and on fire*

PF: Ok, ready to shoot the approach?

PM: No, I don't have the numbers yet.

PF: But we're on fire! I've declared an emergency and app has cleared us for the approach, emergency equipment is standing by, the wing is about to fall off. Plus the runway is 10,001 feet long!

PM: Hold on, just five more minutes, Could you hold the plane steady I'm trying to read this chart. Wait, how do you calculate runway slope again?

frmrdashtrash

Bold means you're authorized to ignore the charts ya'll are complaining about (except in the sim of course).

gijoe411

Yes, of course the sim is what i'm talking about. Who in their right mind would do this in real conditions?

crabinow16

The sim is where this is really gonna make it hard. Isn't training here hard enough with out adding some complicated math calculations to this thing.

Did you read the examples they gave in the FIL? Was anyone else as confused as i was about how your actually supposed to do this?

FixTheMess

I'm assuming they are going to stock the sim/aircraft with E6B's or slide-rule's to perform all the math, since electronic devices aren't allowed while in sterile cockpit, and our cheap-a$$ FMS's don't have the capability.