Originally Posted by Mesabah

Another factor that needs to be looked at is the way information is presented to pilots. The dangerously decreasing airspeed went unnoticed by both pilots. It's literally "SURPRISE stick shaker". I think neither pilot knew that the plane was in a stall situation, certainly not the captain. This lack off feedback from the airplane until the last second is a huge systems flaw. Something as simple as the airspeed tape blinking if the airspeed falls below a set ref speed probably would have prevented this accident.

Originally Posted by aviatorpr

as tragic as this incident was, it is a typical event that must take place to get the attention of everyone to motivate them and educate them that change is needed. the low wages and hours are absurd and pre-historic. RIP to those who lost their lives but better duty and rest requirements may come from this and for that we should be grateful

Originally Posted by bryris

If you need the lights to get brighter, flash, and the "*****ing Betty" to yell at you, etc in order to maintain situational awareness adequate to not crash the airplane, you are better suited for another line of work.

The systems on this airplane were adequate. This was not a systems short coming, it was entirely a pilot induced problem.

Instrument flying, lesson #1 talks about maintaining a proper scan. Letting an instrument escape from the scan is a problem. Sure, you could make it flash and remind the crew, "I am still here!!!!", but this problem should be beneath anyone acting as a professional pilot, especially with 50 people on board.

Originally Posted by The Juice

I have never had any issues calling in sick at Colgan, personally.

What kind of stuff has happened to you with calling in sick?

Originally Posted by CaptainTeezy

This is 100% correct...

The Capt was never tasked with being a real PIC at the basic levels. For example no real amount of VFR 91 Single pilot PIC such as traffic watch, no CFIing for a significant amount of time, and no 135 single pilot IFR.

And then he is all of a sudden expected to be a PIC because he has been babysat by a PIC for 2 years??? You cant emulate PIC leadership just by sitting next to someone else doing it. You have to get experience that should take place at much lower levels rather than the very first PIC responsibility on a 75 seat aircraft. If he would have been an experienced CFI I am 95% sure this would have never happened...How many times as a CFI do you tell your students to stop getting low and slow on final?

If he would have been a 135 single pilot IFR pilot I am 99.999999% sure this would have never happened.

But seniority is what it's all about and prior experience means nothing at the airlines...hopefully there wont be more crashes due to inexperience crews, but I fear that this will not be the last.

The FO was just irresponsible with her rest and commute practices. But being sick...I have flown sick and tired and let me tell you...I have never come close to letting the plane get sooo slow that it is about to stall, and more attention is paid when the flaps are going down.

When I watched the computer simlulator based on the black box data...this crash was pathetic and devastatingly obvious that people need to focus on getting more PIC experience before going to the airlines.

Originally Posted by The Juice

So anyone who makes it through upgrade training is ready to be PIC of an aircraft? Marvin only had 150 hours PIC TOTAL when he was upgraded to left seat on the Saab, does that make him ready?
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Originally Posted by bryris

If you need the lights to get brighter, flash, and the "*****ing Betty" to yell at you, etc in order to maintain situational awareness adequate to not crash the airplane, you are better suited for another line of work.

The systems on this airplane were adequate. This was not a systems short coming, it was entirely a pilot induced problem.

Instrument flying, lesson #1 talks about maintaining a proper scan. Letting an instrument escape from the scan is a problem. Sure, you could make it flash and remind the crew, "I am still here!!!!", but this problem should be beneath anyone acting as a professional pilot, especially with 50 people on board.

Originally Posted by Mesabah

Another factor that needs to be looked at is the way information is presented to pilots. The dangerously decreasing airspeed went unnoticed by both pilots. It's literally "SURPRISE stick shaker". I think neither pilot knew that the plane was in a stall situation, certainly not the captain. This lack off feedback from the airplane until the last second is a huge systems flaw. Something as simple as the airspeed tape blinking if the airspeed falls below a set ref speed probably would have prevented this accident.