Wow, it wasn't that bad for me as an SIC, I was given on average 3 fly days and 2 counter shifts per work week. What you're talking about does suck, I probably wouldn't have stayed around either. Pay was $10/ hour but I got a lot of over time on the fly days. As an SIC I was building 70-80 hours a month too. My paychecks were around $800-$900 (bi-weekly) as an SIC. I honestly don't know what the new salary is for SIC's they just started it not too long ago. They did away with training contracts though for PIC's and we now get bonuses for every 6mo we stay with the company, which are progressively larger. It's also a renter's market out here right now, there's a lot of nice places available for rent that are under $600/ month which is another huge factor in the cost of living as well. I might have moved on by now if the industry was stronger. But for now I don't consider it such a bad place to be.

 

Southwest, for one, doesn't mean "multi"

# Flight Experience: 2,500 hours total or 1,500 hours TURBINE total. Additionally, a minimum of 1,000 hours in Turbine aircraft as the Pilot in command3 (as defined below) is required. Southwest considers only Pilot time in fixed-wing aircraft. This specifically excludes simulator, helicopter, WSO, RIO, FE, NAV, EWO etc. NO other time is counted.3

(From the Southwest employment page)

 

I find it difficult to live on 30k/per year here in Hawaii. Maybe if there were two earners living in the same household, live would be alot better. I currently live in a small studio just outside Waikiki. I pay 850/mo. It is possible to find 600/month but that would either mean you are living in a shared room or apartment, or you live 15 or so miles out of town which is far on this rock if you consider how horrible traffic is.

 

Well.. it sounds like it has gotten a LITTLE bit better, but still far from what it should be. When I was there you had to work the counter/ramp 4 days a week and they'd let you fly ONE day out of the week... that adds up to what, 20-30 hours at most a month? At that rate, it would've taken a looong time for SICs to upgrade! (considering most of the SICs hired have fresh commercial cert.)
I guess with all the crazy attribution they finally realized that they would need to start paying you guys a little more... though, a $2 raise is a joke when the pay was beyond terrible to begin with.

 

Ok, but you said you live right off Waikiki, I'd expect that to be pretty expensive. One of our former ca work for Air Med now and has told me on several occasions how much more difficult it is to find reasonable housing on Oahu than Maui. Also consider that $30,000 is more than Island Air makes starting out and only a few thousand less than first year FO pay at Hawaiian. I mean lets face it, it doesn't matter where you're flying the first year or two there will not be much disposable income.

 

I dunno, Maui is a more expensive island than Oahu. I lived in Maui and the CHEAPEST place I could find was a room in someone's house way up in Haiku.. it was still $600. (which was way more than 50% of my income from PW!)
You're right.. first year FO pay at Hawaiian sucks too.. but that's not an apples to apples comparision. UPS first year pay is $30/hr, would you say they are on the same boat as PW because their first year pay sucks as much as PW? Hawaiian is a destination airline, and pay DOES get a lot better after that. That's why pilots are willing to put up with crappy first year pay at most majors because they plan to be there for life. As for PW, or other "stepping stone" places like regionals... you have no idea how long you will be "stuck" there with sh!tty pay and shi!tty QOL... that's why a lot of the guys on here tout QOL and pay at the "better" regionals so much. Because when you get stuck at a crappy company for a longer period of time than you planned, you'll realize the importance of decent pay/QOL.
As for your Island Air comparison, that's not apples to apples either. Your $30k is for captains at PW, and you were comparing that to FO pay at Island Air. Like you, most pilots at PW are hired as SICs, and they definitely don't make more than FOs at Island Air. Also, Island Air is multi turbine time which is acceptable to majors, single turbine (non-military) would not be accepted by most majors, if any at all.
And besides the whole pay issue, I just found their managment (or lack thereof) just atrocious. They treated us like we were scum. Maybe it has gotten better for you now, but you have to understand, that the way it was only in the past recent years and that's why they have such a horrible reputation.

 

I'm really done with this whole arguement. I respectfully disagree with you and I'll leave it with that. My basis on comparison of those salaries was purely to point out that pilots at other "respectable" Hawaii carriers make comprable pay and no one seems to be questioning their ability to survive out here. That's the only point I was making. My last thought on this discussion is this; a close relative of mine works at what many consider to be THE premiere carrier in the United States and one of the most respected companies in the World (FedEx). He's been working in this industry for over 30 years and flown DC-8, 747, DC-10, and 727. He shares stories with me on a fairly regular basis about guys that he flies with who just want to complain non-stop for the entire month. They don't like the hotel, management this... The point being, no matter what level of flying you do there will always be pilots who don't think it's good enough.

 

I'm really done with this whole arguement. I respectfully disagree with you and I'll leave it with that. My basis on comparison of those salaries was purely to point out that pilots at other "respectable" Hawaii carriers make comprable pay and no one seems to be questioning their ability to survive out here. That's the only point I was making. My last thought on this discussion is this; a close relative of mine works at what many consider to be THE premiere carrier in the United States and one of the most respected companies in the World (FedEx). He's been working in this industry for over 30 years and flown DC-8, 747, DC-10, and 727. He shares stories with me on a fairly regular basis about guys that he flies with who just want to complain non-stop for the entire month. They don't like the hotel, management this... The point being, no matter what level of flying you do there will always be pilots who don't think it's good enough.

 

It wasn't an argument.. you can't actually disagree with someone's own experience. My experience was a really bad one, and so were those of many others. In your first post, you were wondering why people put PW down so much. I'm telling you why. Obviously, you like it there. That doesn't take away from all the negative experiences of all those who came before you.

True, people will always complain.. but PW is surely no Fedex!

 

A turbine is a turbine is a turbine. Come on dude!

p.s. ok maybe it's different with choppers I don't know never flown one