I am getting really tired of the arguement coming from Cohen and others that flight instructing is the same hour over and over again until you hit 1500. Yes, as an instructor I spent quite a bit of time "banging the pattern", but you know what else I did even more? Teaching and demonstrating stall/spin entry and recovery. Considering that Colgan 3407 went down because of improper stall recovery (CA reconfigured the aircraft by calling for gear up, and the FO threw the flaps up on her own) then perhaps a few more of this "same" hour over and over again might have been a not such a bad idea.

 

I find it hard to believe you made 26k as a first year FO in 1997. I find it hard to believe any of your statement after having to ask if a 2nd year FO makes 40K. You are out of touch with reality if you think a normal second year FO makes 40K. It is possible if you have no life but for a normal FO there is no way. My W2 for a full year of FO pay my first year was under 19K, five years in and I still haven't had a W2 over 40K yet.

 

The experience gained while CFIing is some of the best you will ever get. Most who did it will know this to be the case. I flew with a lot of FO's over the years and I'll take a seasoned CFII/MEI anyday over someone who just went and bought 500/1000/1500 hours of time buzzing around.

 

True. I'm on my 3rd regional in 5 years due to being furloughed. And I'm gonna get furloughed again. This business is a joke. I just barely made under $40K this year. Majors need to decide who they want flying for them and stick with it. Whipsawing should be illegal.

 

All i know is, regionals can't get pilots like they use to. We don't have places like Jet U and ATP grads who can go to the regionals with 400 hrs anymore. Private loans are not given out for flight training (unless you go to a college and get your training that way) Not many people are getting their Private's certificate compared to 5-10 years ago. 135 outfit flying bank checks aren't around anymore. So building time is harder than it use to be. I'm not saying there will be a pilot shortage, but what I've listed is hinting there will be one.

 

The atp rule goes into effect in August. My prediction is its thrown out by December. In fact im sure of it.

 

And the new rest rules go into effect in a year is it? December 11, 2013?

 

In 1997, I made about 22k instructing ($9/hour, 160 hours/month, with $400/month for office duties). At that time, published regional minimum guarantee was equal to or less than that. A 1900 job ranged between 12k and 16k (corrected for inflation they are 17.2k and 23k). I remember distinctly because I asked my coworkers why they were willing to take a pay cut to fly something bigger. Instead, I took a job flying a 208 full of boxes for 24k (34k corrected).

The 1900 rates published now are 14.4 to 15.7k. Effectively that is roughly 20% less than in 1997. Even 30ish seat TP rates at 15.7 to 20.7 are 10% lower than the old 1900 rate.

Interestingly, Caravan rates have stayed fairly flat. Mountain Air (who is always hiring) starts 'Van drivers at 34.4k.

No. I plan my budget for guarantee. That is all I am assured of earning, and sitting reserve there were several months that was about all I got.

Not sure why people arguing about low pay always have to talk about how much they made "back in my day."

 

Agreed. And flying IAH to CLL turns is just doing the same thing over and over again.

 

1. There will be no pilot shortage. There won't even be a shortage of people willing to fly jets for 4-800 dollar paychecks every two weeks. Just because airlines are doing limited hiring doesn't mean there will ever be a shortage and everyone will have jobs now. Need more evidence? They don't even hire mostly CFIs anymore, because prior 121 guys are beating the doors down.

2. It is nearly impossible in today's instructing climate to get 1,500 hours in a reasonable time frame, and to get the cross country. You'd have to work at ATP, and there is an 8 month backlog to get into standardizations after you graduate. I work at a very high volume school, because 141 foreign ab initio is one of the few ways to get any hours at all besides ATP, and the syllabus and scheduling does not support going out and turning their training into scenario based cross countries. That's most of these forieng ab initio places.


The 'bah humbugs' of older more experienced pilots regarding the difficulties experienced by new pilots are out of ignorance. There's never been a generation faced with what we are. I look forward to learning how to be a better pilot from you guys one day....if I ever get a 141 job. I've been 300 hours from even the potential of meeting mins for 12 months. They raise them as I get them.