Eagle AIP is alive again.
03-07-2014 | 03:05 PM
#31
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,707
Likes: 0
Time for all the pilots to get off the toilet seat and stand up and VOTE NO.
start the grass root effort now.
Know one thing, voting yes does not stop them from coming back next year just as they did this year.
SKW got 8% pay raises and was not required to give up anything, compared to us.
RAH getting 10-20% pay raises, compared to us in there TA, being voted this month.
EJT sent a resounding NO to there management. There management is waiting to see what they have to offer after the RAH and now Eagle vote.
Flow increase, you are talking about 60 seats only and the company can hold you and make up the number at the end of the year. Flow can stop for any reason after the 824 have gone.
Voting yes guarantees nothing except that if you get stuck here you will not get any real pay raises for 10 years. Voting yes only guarantees you lose 1 week vacation if you fall into that group that does and most of you do. Voting yes guarantees 4/12 year caps for pilots with no change for 10 years and most of you will fall into to this.
Point is there are no guarantees that the flow wont stop and you will be stuck here. There are no guarantees you will get hired at a mainline and you then are stuck here.
Simple example; AA/US MOU states AAG will not transfer flying to US from AA and vise a versa. That AAG will not downsize one group while increasing the other group from transfer of flying and that all current aircraft will be flown by respective pilots. Hers the catch; It has been done before here, Eagle flying is transferred to US Airways as it is currently being done in MIA, ORD and NYC, this increases US Airways flying while decreasing Eagle flying. Now AAG transfers former AA flying to Eagle and downsizes AA through attrition. Hiring continues at US Airways (which you flow does you no good) and hiring at AA ceases or trickles at best and you are stuck here. If you think this wont happen as it is already starting, go ahead and roll the dice, but, when you are stuck here DONT WHINE because you voted yes.
Is this extreme, NO WAY. Done before to the extent AMR delayed aircraft deliveries for 2 years
to stop/delay the flow for 2 years and in the mean time hiring was at 100 a month. 2400 pilots senior now to those who should have had numbers for flow.
Company stated to the MEC that they will not improve or negotiate the AIP because they believe you will take this AIP as is. If and when VOTED DOWN with large resounding NO VOTES they will have to negotiate a better deal. Management at AAG is betting the eagle pilots are a bunch of spineless slime as they were with the bankruptcy vote.
VOTE NO hold your head high. Don't listen to those senior pilots (I am a senior pilot) who tell you to vote yes, they just want to ride the train to retirement or use you junior pilots to enhance there ability to flow to AA while you get stuck here and live under this POS AIP TA.
I am as state senior pilot, I really lose nothing in this AIP/TA but I am a NO VOTE.
VOTE NO
start the grass root effort now.
Know one thing, voting yes does not stop them from coming back next year just as they did this year.
SKW got 8% pay raises and was not required to give up anything, compared to us.
RAH getting 10-20% pay raises, compared to us in there TA, being voted this month.
EJT sent a resounding NO to there management. There management is waiting to see what they have to offer after the RAH and now Eagle vote.
Flow increase, you are talking about 60 seats only and the company can hold you and make up the number at the end of the year. Flow can stop for any reason after the 824 have gone.
Voting yes guarantees nothing except that if you get stuck here you will not get any real pay raises for 10 years. Voting yes only guarantees you lose 1 week vacation if you fall into that group that does and most of you do. Voting yes guarantees 4/12 year caps for pilots with no change for 10 years and most of you will fall into to this.
Point is there are no guarantees that the flow wont stop and you will be stuck here. There are no guarantees you will get hired at a mainline and you then are stuck here.
Simple example; AA/US MOU states AAG will not transfer flying to US from AA and vise a versa. That AAG will not downsize one group while increasing the other group from transfer of flying and that all current aircraft will be flown by respective pilots. Hers the catch; It has been done before here, Eagle flying is transferred to US Airways as it is currently being done in MIA, ORD and NYC, this increases US Airways flying while decreasing Eagle flying. Now AAG transfers former AA flying to Eagle and downsizes AA through attrition. Hiring continues at US Airways (which you flow does you no good) and hiring at AA ceases or trickles at best and you are stuck here. If you think this wont happen as it is already starting, go ahead and roll the dice, but, when you are stuck here DONT WHINE because you voted yes.
Is this extreme, NO WAY. Done before to the extent AMR delayed aircraft deliveries for 2 years
to stop/delay the flow for 2 years and in the mean time hiring was at 100 a month. 2400 pilots senior now to those who should have had numbers for flow.
Company stated to the MEC that they will not improve or negotiate the AIP because they believe you will take this AIP as is. If and when VOTED DOWN with large resounding NO VOTES they will have to negotiate a better deal. Management at AAG is betting the eagle pilots are a bunch of spineless slime as they were with the bankruptcy vote.
VOTE NO hold your head high. Don't listen to those senior pilots (I am a senior pilot) who tell you to vote yes, they just want to ride the train to retirement or use you junior pilots to enhance there ability to flow to AA while you get stuck here and live under this POS AIP TA.
I am as state senior pilot, I really lose nothing in this AIP/TA but I am a NO VOTE.
VOTE NO
03-07-2014 | 03:27 PM
#33
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 528
Likes: 0
From: LeftSeat PA-44
Just like you have no merit at the PSA thread yet you stuck your nose there time and time again. So I think I will stick around. If you don't want me to participate why don't you just post on eagle lounge. That $5 cover charge will surely keep guys like me out.
03-07-2014 | 04:31 PM
#35
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 264
Likes: 0
03-07-2014 | 08:15 PM
#37
Line Holder
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
03-07-2014 | 08:26 PM
#38
Line Holder
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 96
Likes: 0
From: Bent Over
This will get voted down 75-80%
Every time the company says they wont come back to the table, they have come back.
Even guys who were potential Yes voters initially are beginning to see how weak the company's hand really is.
You can only cry wolf so many times before even the sheep begin to realize there is no wolf.
Every time the company says they wont come back to the table, they have come back.
Even guys who were potential Yes voters initially are beginning to see how weak the company's hand really is.
You can only cry wolf so many times before even the sheep begin to realize there is no wolf.
03-07-2014 | 08:30 PM
#39
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 120
Likes: 0
From: CFI, CFII, MEI, ATP
this will get voted down 75-80%
every time the company says they wont come back to the table, they have come back.
Even guys who were potential yes voters initially are beginning to see how weak the company's hand really is.
You can only cry wolf so many times before even the sheep begin to realize there is no wolf.
every time the company says they wont come back to the table, they have come back.
Even guys who were potential yes voters initially are beginning to see how weak the company's hand really is.
You can only cry wolf so many times before even the sheep begin to realize there is no wolf.
+ 1,000,000
03-07-2014 | 08:45 PM
#40
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 869
Likes: 0
(Copy-Pasted from Facebook)
RI: The company does not think we accurately represent the real wishes of the pilots.
We have been ineffective at gaining any real significant improvements because they don't think we actually represent the majority.
They are prepared to send a batch of planes to another carrier, which is something we always knew they could try. We lost over 110 pilots since new year. If they do award that contract - even if the other airline can't staff it NEXT YEAR - what happens to Eagle in the meantime?
They refuse to negotiate improvements beyond this since they don't think we accurately represent the majority.
This is your chance to tell them we DO represent you, and that when we told them concessions won't fly, we meant it.
RI: The company does not think we accurately represent the real wishes of the pilots.
We have been ineffective at gaining any real significant improvements because they don't think we actually represent the majority.
They are prepared to send a batch of planes to another carrier, which is something we always knew they could try. We lost over 110 pilots since new year. If they do award that contract - even if the other airline can't staff it NEXT YEAR - what happens to Eagle in the meantime?
They refuse to negotiate improvements beyond this since they don't think we accurately represent the majority.
This is your chance to tell them we DO represent you, and that when we told them concessions won't fly, we meant it.
well said
.........
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