Originally Posted by ZBowFlyz;1619815[B

]The single most over looked detail is simple and often overlooked- Where does the money to pay properly come from?

It comes from mother DAL and father UAL and the mistress AAL. We love to hate regional management and they deserve 99% of it however, they bid their routes based on a specific labor cost. If we exceed that then our companies go TU. Along with our jobs. That is basic business.

[/B]This is the natural ebb and flow of capitalism. Once we understand the supply and demand curve we can see how the RJ operators are just the pool boys for their respective Legacies. At their mercy. Be smart enough to direct the "Pay hate" at it's source.

Don't misunderstand me, I dislike management as much as the next guy and feel like we are grossly underpaid but I am also well aware that there is too much competition in our industry. A few have become too expensive and they will fall by the way side. This might help to find the balance in this industry. Look how long it took to shut down Comair. Size doesn't matter. If the company is too expensive it will cease to exist.

The interesting thing is the 1500hr rule and 117. Today isn't as simple as it used to be due to these barriers to entry for new pilots. Predictions are pure speculation at this point but the companies that will survive the storm in my opinion, will be the Regionals without 50 seaters and a relatively junior (inexpensive) pilot group.

The industry needs re fleeted and that is one step in mitigating the "shortage" The situation may force mainline to accelerate the rate at which they park uneconomical aircraft such as the 135/145s/200s etc.

Hopefully, as we go through this "capitalistic valley" the legacy's will take back the flying (at a respectable pay rate for the pilots) or the remaining companies will bid more fat in their contracts. One way or another, it will get worse before it gets better. IMO

Originally Posted by NVUS

Money losing investments up front, money making investments down the road

Originally Posted by Avroman

Jazz does IAH-YYC, Mesaba (R.I.P.) did DTW-SLC on CRJ-900's Nothing like 4+ hours in one of these torture devices, at least it's not on a 200.

Originally Posted by Paid2fly

No, actually Air Mekong lost money the entire time(that Skywest owned it) and was sold at a loss. The carrier in Brazil lost money the entire time(they owned it), it was also sold at a loss, and they claim that they are and have been losing money on the original Expressjet side of the house.

Originally Posted by TBucket

They also pay quite a bit more than US regionals. From what i hear, you can actually make a living on their payrates. (oddly, they seem to have disappeared from APC, though, so i can't cite numbers)

Originally Posted by Avroman

This is why ALPA is a complete FAILURE! A real union would have prevented this with HARD FLOORS. No contract would be allowed below a minimum pay, benefits, and work rules. There would be no option to undercut based on pilot costs. Instead we have ALPA sign off on the turd (albeit in bankruptcy) at Endeavor that should have been flushed into the Hudson. Then even more egregiously, they promoted that absolutely inexcusable dumpster fire at PSA (*** were you all thinking?). ALPA should have been shown the door at every regional the next day for that BS... At least now maybe there is a beginning hint at a clue.. Then again I'm betting we will hear ALPA start supporting the multi crew license or Ab Initio, or even push for easier loans for new trainees.

Originally Posted by NVUS

That's because we're talking Canadian Dollars vs. US Dollars. $23/hr in the US is $25/hr in Canada.

Originally Posted by pagey

Their rates even in US dollars are far and away above regionals here.

I think it starts around 40 and tops at around 60.

The captain rates are pretty comparable to captains here.

Originally Posted by pagey

Their rates even in US dollars are far and away above regionals here.

I think it starts around 40 and tops at around 60.

The captain rates are pretty comparable to captains here.

Originally Posted by XJT Pilot

This is 100% ALPA's doing and in the name of good pay for the pond jumpers. News flash their what 10% of ALPA's membership. Furthermore, 90% of you guys reading this will never see the left seat of a wide body. ALPA is not a union, its an association. Unions have one seniority list and a pool to take from. Until we achieve one list you guys can bloviate all you want about what were worth, were never gonna get it as long as management knows they can close down and start us over. PERIOD!