No, you misunderstand me. If another carrier had done this, I'd be just as critical as it is the concept of what "poaching" can start and that affects ALL present and future regional pilots regardless of where they may come from. It negatively impacts the regional profession. I know many are simply too blind to consider all the ramifications or simply have no interest in doing so and if you leave this segment of the industry soon, no harm, no foul because you've got yours. But..........should something unforeseen occur and you end up at the regional level far longer then you had hoped, you'll be lying a bed you wish you hadn't made.

It's your future..................good luck. Sounds like you'll need it.

Again......*sigh*.....salaries are one thing, but methodologies that target other carriers pilots are not. Hey, with that logic and mentality why do you have a union anyway and in many cases, the SAME union (ALPA) ? One ALPA carriers MEC targets another and you call that GOOD ?

Man, I'll never understand the present generation of regional pilots. You guys have a bleak future embracing and rationalizing cannibalism and hopefully yours won't become one of the casualties. If this possible scheme backfires and Envoy becomes the casualty of its own making (just like last time when the MEC fumbled their own drive), you can be sure the same salesmen here will be the ones crying the loudest blaming others for their demise (and almost certainly me, as if one guy on a forum with an opinion could sink an airline , which they already insinuate).

They will ?

Their captains, both senior and junior will be given either their old captains pay for their new reserve F/O slot at the bottom of someone else's list or lateral street captains slot at airline X ?

Man, you're not thinking this through. There will be winners and losers in both pilots and airlines and you'll be in Vegas at the whim of the house.

 

I'm not upset, so no deep breath needed. It is YOU with everything to lose. Slowly read all my posts and try to digest my points. In fact, I'm not going to explain it anymore, but simply wait for a good show to watch. Should that show start, trust me..............then we will have PLENTY to discuss.

 

So, it's just that you don't believe the company will hire former Captains because the cost is too high and they will be left out in the cold. Hence losers.

But wouldn't those same Captains making $100,000+ be left in a bad spot even if the starting pay were $50,000 at Envoy? Let's go with 50k to start and 10k raises every single year. It would take 5 years to get back to where you were and an additional 5 years to recoup your losses(not counting inflation).

Even this hypothetical contract would poach other 121 pilots and lead to at least one other regional going out of business.

 

It goes beyond that micro to the macro. It divides the unionized pilots further advocating an "us and them" concept. From an entertainment standpoint (and this would be a depressing drama and not a comedy.........well, it would have some comedic elements ), it would be interesting to watch.

I disagree. It doesn't specifically target other carriers directly. That CONCEPT is the problem. It's no wonder many regional unions and pilots fall prey to the perils they're in nowadays as the thinking abilities of many simply is both too superficial and to self-oriented. If one raises pay, other do too. If one offers bonuses, other do too which has already occurred and BTW, with very marginal results. One union MEC taking direct aim at others pilots starts a different game. I don't think that will be a healthy game for ANYONE and if you cannot understand that, by all means go ahead and play it and we'll find out. Place your bet that you won't be one of the losers in that game. I'm just watching that game and again, it would sure get interesting.

I've said before that if Delta or UAL were to see a potentially successful threat to their regional feed and thus the core carrier, they'll react accordingly. So far that hasn't occurred. If Envoy's flow claims start really impacting that, those two carriers could easily blunt that in very short order. I've heard Delta will need 1000 pilots over the next year or so and United a lot too, whereas AA some furloughees left to call and only a few hundred to retire over that time and so could those carriers instantly stop movement away from their network carriers, if necessary ?

What would happen to Envoy by this time next year, if so ?

If you're at Envoy, don't be so sure this hand will be a winning one as you never know what cards you draw or what the dealer has in the future. I'm looking out for Envoy as much as any other regional in this respect as let's face it, the present Envoy MEC is NOT known for their shrewd bargaining or strategy. They are closer to the Keystone Cops and in fact, are under fire from snipers from past ethically bankrupt MEC's to regain control to make even more short-sighted decisions.

 

Ok, I've not read all of this thread, but all of you need to take a big giant chill pill and realize that whatever happens at the regionals in the next few years is just going to be a short term bandaid before the Big Major Staffing Crisis of the 2020s.

And as Exhibit A, I give you this:



And if big jet regionals as we know them today disappear before then, so much the better.

 

I'm truly amazed by eaglefly's ability to make a thread completely about his opinions that none of us are smart enough to understand.

 

Shouldn't surprise anyone anymore at this point. Just let him talk to himself..it's what he normally does anyway.

 

Still talking too much!

 

I stopped reading after the first couple sentences.....

That being said how in the world would pilots being able to transfer their pay to another airline be bad? This is the main reason we are in such a terrible situation with regionals in the first place.

I'm going to throw a "no freakin' way this ever happens" out there but if this is at all fact good for Eagle ALPA. This would truly be a game changer.

 

Most, almost all regionals are offering a first year incentive. With those incentives it puts first year pay above Envoys.

Nothing constructive to read here.

Please close this thread.