PRS Guitars

Yes, the student (dual) will perform the formation landing after seeing an IP demo it once. A solo student on the wing can do a formation approach with a go around at 300’ IIRC.

trip

Very sad news today. I knew one of the IP's from years ago at Fallon, our boys went to school together and we'd always talk about flying, airlines, USMC/Navy stuff. He was looking forward to separating out and moving home to OKC. R.I.P

USMCFLYR

Here is a 30+ min discussion of the AIB report.
Nothing really new discussed, rather just explained more in-depth for the casual observer.

Two notes to his points made though - F/A-18s train in formation approaches and landings as part of the syllabus - at least when I left the RAG/FRS when I retired. They are fairly easy to fly and execute - never known of a problem as I think I made mention in a previous post.
Second - I'll respectively disagree with his contention that it was a good thing to take formation landings out of the syllabus - though I am not qualified to remark on the risk-vs-benefit in the T-38 specifically - I would like to know of other T-38 formation mishaps compared to the number of formation landings. I think I said earlier in the thread too - that the first time you do a formation landing ought not to be in your fleet aircraft. I personally stand firm with that opinion.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttx0a7p1g9w

Edit - USAF people - something that I did find interesting in the 'legal' report of the AIB (like a USN/USMC/USCG JAGMAN), was no finding of Line of Duty (LOD) determination which you will find in the other service's legal reports (the whole purpose of a JAGMAN (and potential claims against the government))
Is this standard?

galaxy flyer

I’d agree on your comment that removing the form landings from UPT was not a bad idea. IIRC, back in the dat, fighter qual’d studs had to demonstrate 4 proficient form landings. They’re turning RAG/RTU instructors with expensive planes into UPT..

Cant say about an AIB, but there are LOD determination investigations in the USAF. Done a bunch.

GF

USMCFLYR

GF -

You may have misspoke because you stated that you agree with me when I say "that removing the form landings from UPT was not a bad idea."

I think removing formation landings from UPT IS A BAD IDEA.
The guy doing the video didn't think it was a bad idea and I was DIASGREEING with him.

I'm watching another AIB video on the low transition/gear up F-22 landing at Fallon and again - I'm not seeing a LOD. Maybe the USN/USMC is just more blunt about it as the JAGMAN ends with '[I] find XXXX IN/NOT IN the Line of Duty' etc.... (paraphrasing here - I'm not pulling out the Command Legal Course books here. )

galaxy flyer

yeah, I did screw up the typing. I agree, it’s a bad idea to remove form landings in UPT. I don’t think they were a major contributor to the accident rate over the decades that the T-38 has been in service. It’s had several maintenance issues causing accidents.