Asiana 777 Crash at SFO
07-09-2013, 12:11 AM
#331
Rubber dogsh#t out of HKG
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: Senior Seat Cushion Tester Extraordinaire
Posts: 620
Originally Posted by F15andMD11
Yea, I understand what you're saying about rusty but...not impressed.
For a ferry flt sure. But a revenue flt no! I've watched guys shut-off the automation. "Look what a good pilot I am." What do you think the media's and the company's reaction will be when they learn you have the automation off and you were, God forbid, involved in a mishap. Especially those with safety redundancies like auto throttles. You'd be hung out to dry. Just wait until we learn Asiana had AT off. The pilots will be even more roasted. IMO once you're in the big leagues flying heavy metal those "look at me" days are over!! For your passengers sake!! Sorry, I'll get off my soap box. Just my safety training. :
For a ferry flt sure. But a revenue flt no! I've watched guys shut-off the automation. "Look what a good pilot I am." What do you think the media's and the company's reaction will be when they learn you have the automation off and you were, God forbid, involved in a mishap. Especially those with safety redundancies like auto throttles. You'd be hung out to dry. Just wait until we learn Asiana had AT off. The pilots will be even more roasted. IMO once you're in the big leagues flying heavy metal those "look at me" days are over!! For your passengers sake!! Sorry, I'll get off my soap box. Just my safety training. :As for a ferry vs revenue flight....what‘s the difference? I don't care who or what's in back with regard to the level of safety with which I operate.
"Big leagues"?
Seriously? Again, my safety philosophy was the same in the little league and in neither league did I have a "look at me" attitude.It would be ironic if some of the Asiana higher-ups will consider limiting manual flying even more due to this accident.....which possibly is the very reason for the apparent poor airmanship.
You can have your presumptions about me being a show-off and your auto-throttles on all approaches. I‘ll stick with taking every opportunity to stay proficient on manual flying. Because someday, that automation might go kaput and if it does, I'll be better prepared than if I never switch off the A/T's.
07-09-2013, 12:26 AM
#332
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2005
Position: outside
Posts: 662
Originally Posted by F15andMD11
Yea, I understand what you're saying about rusty but...not impressed. For a ferry flt sure. But a revenue flt no! I've watched guys shut-off the automation. "Look what a good pilot I am." What do you think the media's and the company's reaction will be when they learn you have the automation off and you were, God forbid, involved in a mishap. Especially those with safety redundancies like auto throttles. You'd be hung out to dry. Just wait until we learn Asiana had AT off. The pilots will be even more roasted. IMO once you're in the big leagues flying heavy metal those "look at me" days are over!! For your passengers sake!! Sorry, I'll get off my soap box. Just my safety training. 
For a ferry flt sure. But a revenue flt no! I've watched guys shut-off the automation. "Look what a good pilot I am." What do you think the media's and the company's reaction will be when they learn you have the automation off and you were, God forbid, involved in a mishap. Especially those with safety redundancies like auto throttles. You'd be hung out to dry. Just wait until we learn Asiana had AT off. The pilots will be even more roasted. IMO once you're in the big leagues flying heavy metal those "look at me" days are over!! For your passengers sake!! Sorry, I'll get off my soap box. Just my safety training. this is seriously funny. what?
07-09-2013, 02:25 AM
#333
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2012
Posts: 400
Originally Posted by F15andMD11
Yea, I understand what you're saying about rusty but...not impressed. For a ferry flt sure. But a revenue flt no! I've watched guys shut-off the automation. "Look what a good pilot I am." What do you think the media's and the company's reaction will be when they learn you have the automation off and you were, God forbid, involved in a mishap. Especially those with safety redundancies like auto throttles. You'd be hung out to dry. Just wait until we learn Asiana had AT off. The pilots will be even more roasted. IMO once you're in the big leagues flying heavy metal those "look at me" days are over!! For your passengers sake!! Sorry, I'll get off my soap box. Just my safety training.
For a ferry flt sure. But a revenue flt no! I've watched guys shut-off the automation. "Look what a good pilot I am." What do you think the media's and the company's reaction will be when they learn you have the automation off and you were, God forbid, involved in a mishap. Especially those with safety redundancies like auto throttles. You'd be hung out to dry. Just wait until we learn Asiana had AT off. The pilots will be even more roasted. IMO once you're in the big leagues flying heavy metal those "look at me" days are over!! For your passengers sake!! Sorry, I'll get off my soap box. Just my safety training. Anyway, what sort of safety training taught you to let your skills deteriorate?
07-09-2013, 04:17 AM
#334
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,152
Originally Posted by BE02Driverz
Speaking only in the USA/ FAA structured airlines, some more specific SIM training could help us all. Unless your company has a custom SIM training program approved by the FAA you get the "canned" training wherein the FAA dictates exactly what has to be covered for each PC/PT event. Usually making the SIM time rushed and without the luxury of trying anything ourside of the FAA training curriculum.
07-09-2013, 04:30 AM
#335
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: B767 Capt.
Posts: 616
I applaud the NTSB chairman speaking to them like they're 4 year olds.
Based on how they botch aviation reporting, how likely do you think it is that they botch every other non-aviation story they attempt?
Based on how they botch aviation reporting, how likely do you think it is that they botch every other non-aviation story they attempt?
07-09-2013, 05:07 AM
#336
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: Body at sea level; heart at 70,000+
Posts: 1,349
I'm sure there are more but I remember the old expression:
"Three most useless things in the world: runway behind you, altitude above you and airspeed you don't have."
The politically correct description is "energy management."
"Three most useless things in the world: runway behind you, altitude above you and airspeed you don't have."
The politically correct description is "energy management."
07-09-2013, 05:39 AM
#337
Runs with scissors
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: Going to hell in a bucket, but enjoying the ride .
Posts: 7,722
Originally Posted by Ftrooppilot
I'm sure there are more but I remember the old expression:
"Three most useless things in the world: runway behind you, altitude above you and airspeed you don't have."
"Three most useless things in the world: runway behind you, altitude above you and airspeed you don't have."
Airspeed is Life.
Altitude is Life Insurance.
07-09-2013, 06:10 AM
#338
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2007
Position: CA
Posts: 148
Originally Posted by F15andMD11
Yea, I understand what you're saying about rusty but...not impressed. For a ferry flt sure. But a revenue flt no! I've watched guys shut-off the automation. "Look what a good pilot I am." What do you think the media's and the company's reaction will be when they learn you have the automation off and you were, God forbid, involved in a mishap. Especially those with safety redundancies like auto throttles. You'd be hung out to dry. Just wait until we learn Asiana had AT off. The pilots will be even more roasted. IMO once you're in the big leagues flying heavy metal those "look at me" days are over!! For your passengers sake!! Sorry, I'll get off my soap box. Just my safety training.
For a ferry flt sure. But a revenue flt no! I've watched guys shut-off the automation. "Look what a good pilot I am." What do you think the media's and the company's reaction will be when they learn you have the automation off and you were, God forbid, involved in a mishap. Especially those with safety redundancies like auto throttles. You'd be hung out to dry. Just wait until we learn Asiana had AT off. The pilots will be even more roasted. IMO once you're in the big leagues flying heavy metal those "look at me" days are over!! For your passengers sake!! Sorry, I'll get off my soap box. Just my safety training.
Originally Posted by Globerunner513
07-09-2013, 06:18 AM
#339
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 11,989
Was Asiana LCA a scab?
The labor minister, Kim Dae Hwan, said, "The government has determined that if the strike by Asiana pilots continues, it would not only cause inconveniences for the people but also threaten the safety of air travelers and hurt the national economy."
The action came after Asiana's management and union failed to reach a compromise in last-minute talks in a mountain resort south of Seoul, where hundreds of Asiana pilots have been staying in a hotel since the walkout began on July 17. The government had given the two sides until Wednesday to reach a deal or face arbitration.
After the emergency arbitration was announced, the Asiana union said it would end the strike. But 1,800 riot police officers were on standby outside the hotel on Wednesday, waiting for an order to move in, in case any of the pilots refused to return to work despite the government order.
Asiana's strike has been the worst for South Korea's aviation industry. Since the walkout began, the airline has been forced to cancel more than 2,200 domestic and international flights, or one-third of its total scheduled flights.The strike has cost the airline an estimated 165 billion won, or $163 million, in lost revenue from passenger and cargo services, the government said on Wednesday.
Asiana has been operating with nonunion pilots and union members who did not join the strike. About 500 of the airline's 839 pilots are unionized. The union said about 400 pilots had been on strike.
Pilots are calling for more rest days and fewer flying hours. They also insist on a say in management decisions and on raising the retirement age to 58 from 55.
The action came after Asiana's management and union failed to reach a compromise in last-minute talks in a mountain resort south of Seoul, where hundreds of Asiana pilots have been staying in a hotel since the walkout began on July 17. The government had given the two sides until Wednesday to reach a deal or face arbitration.
After the emergency arbitration was announced, the Asiana union said it would end the strike. But 1,800 riot police officers were on standby outside the hotel on Wednesday, waiting for an order to move in, in case any of the pilots refused to return to work despite the government order.
Asiana's strike has been the worst for South Korea's aviation industry. Since the walkout began, the airline has been forced to cancel more than 2,200 domestic and international flights, or one-third of its total scheduled flights.The strike has cost the airline an estimated 165 billion won, or $163 million, in lost revenue from passenger and cargo services, the government said on Wednesday.
Asiana has been operating with nonunion pilots and union members who did not join the strike. About 500 of the airline's 839 pilots are unionized. The union said about 400 pilots had been on strike.
Pilots are calling for more rest days and fewer flying hours. They also insist on a say in management decisions and on raising the retirement age to 58 from 55.
07-09-2013, 06:38 AM
#340
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Posts: 769
Originally Posted by F15andMD11
Yea, I understand what you're saying about rusty but...not impressed. For a ferry flt sure. But a revenue flt no! I've watched guys shut-off the automation. "Look what a good pilot I am." What do you think the media's and the company's reaction will be when they learn you have the automation off and you were, God forbid, involved in a mishap. Especially those with safety redundancies like auto throttles. You'd be hung out to dry. Just wait until we learn Asiana had AT off. The pilots will be even more roasted. IMO once you're in the big leagues flying heavy metal those "look at me" days are over!! For your passengers sake!! Sorry, I'll get off my soap box. Just my safety training.
For a ferry flt sure. But a revenue flt no! I've watched guys shut-off the automation. "Look what a good pilot I am." What do you think the media's and the company's reaction will be when they learn you have the automation off and you were, God forbid, involved in a mishap. Especially those with safety redundancies like auto throttles. You'd be hung out to dry. Just wait until we learn Asiana had AT off. The pilots will be even more roasted. IMO once you're in the big leagues flying heavy metal those "look at me" days are over!! For your passengers sake!! Sorry, I'll get off my soap box. Just my safety training. 
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