Frontier Negotiations Discussion

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Quote: Did you look at Alan’s example? The value of the first 3 or 4 pairings in his December schedule were increased due to the AMDP.
They could very well be but only because they were constructed using the old rules for optimization. There is just no way to see what the new pairings would look like until you run the program with the new rigs.
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I also wanted to say that I loved the response to the long duration of the contract.

As stated by lead NC. We WANT a long contract because it puts us after everybody else has finished THEIR negotiating and they "do the heavy lifting" for us.

Yeah, because it worked so well for us this time, brought us right up to the bottom. Seriously? WTF?
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My wife has renogiated our current relationship. She says that among her peer group, the other wives are seeing an average of 3 other dudes on the side. She now wants what she defines as an industry standard relationship. I told her that there are other groups where the husbands demand that their wives only sleep with them, but she said that this wasnt our peer group. Negotiating that level of respect will have to wait for the next round of negotiations. I told her that I wanted to keep our existing realtionship rules, but she says everyone else is currently using the Tinder system, so we will have to adopt that software to keep up with the times. There are minor tweaks to that system still to be defined (whether you have to sit and watch, etc) but those will be arbitrated later, after you have already agreed, by a neutral group of wives.

I have a spreadsheet where I can put in some parameters, how much respect I should be getting vs. how much I can ask for, length of time I would have to be alone if i actually stuck up for myself, the present value of relationship vs. waiting for wife2, and the potential improvements I could ask for and get if I waited for Wife2.

If she were a nice person with morals, and not just a gold-digging pilot wife, I might be able to negotiate a better deal for myself, but I am convinced that this is the best deal I can get. I’m simply outmatched. I mean, what if I stick up for myself and then the girlfriend market goes into a recession? What if I kick her to the curb and then have to wait over a year, only to end up with small improvements like a girl who is only 30 instead of 50 lbs overweight, or only demands 2 instead of 3 dudes on the side?

Nope. Better to play it safe and take her offer, right? I mean, Im just a second tier kind of guy, with 2nd tier looks, and a second tier car. Its not like Im on the same level as those guys who demand, and somehow receive the respect they deserve.

(This is a work of fiction. It is meant for entertainment purposes only, and any similarities to the mindset of actual unapologetic yes voters, either living or brain-dead, is unintentional and purely coincidental)
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Quote: They could very well be but only because they were constructed using the old rules for optimization. There is just no way to see what the new pairings would look like until you run the program with the new rigs.
Exactly right. Limited value therefore.
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Harry - Have you considered replacing your MEC? Might set you back a year with your wife. But it might result in a concession. Perhaps 10 lb and 1 dude less on the side. Of course, you might be on SC if one of the two remaining dudes calls in sick, 2 hours show up and ready to perform her bidding.
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Quote: Harry - Have you considered replacing your MEC? Might set you back a year with your wife. But it might result in a concession. Perhaps 10 lb and 1 dude less on the side. Of course, you might be on SC if one of the two remaining dudes calls in sick, 2 hours show up and ready to perform her bidding.
. The jokes write themselves
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Quote: I also wanted to say that I loved the response to the long duration of the contract.

As stated by lead NC. We WANT a long contract because it puts us after everybody else has finished THEIR negotiating and they "do the heavy lifting" for us.

Yeah, because it worked so well for us this time, brought us right up to the bottom. Seriously? WTF?
Most of the responses to the failings of this TA were total b.s. and NOT justifiable reasons to me. Therefore count me as a 100% NO.
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Quote: My wife has renogiated our current relationship. She says that among her peer group, the other wives are seeing an average of 3 other dudes on the side. She now wants what she defines as an industry standard relationship. I told her that there are other groups where the husbands demand that their wives only sleep with them, but she said that this wasnt our peer group. Negotiating that level of respect will have to wait for the next round of negotiations. I told her that I wanted to keep our existing realtionship rules, but she says everyone else is currently using the Tinder system, so we will have to adopt that software to keep up with the times. There are minor tweaks to that system still to be defined (whether you have to sit and watch, etc) but those will be arbitrated later, after you have already agreed, by a neutral group of wives.

I have a spreadsheet where I can put in some parameters, how much respect I should be getting vs. how much I can ask for, length of time I would have to be alone if i actually stuck up for myself, the present value of relationship vs. waiting for wife2, and the potential improvements I could ask for and get if I waited for Wife2.

If she were a nice person with morals, and not just a gold-digging pilot wife, I might be able to negotiate a better deal for myself, but I am convinced that this is the best deal I can get. I’m simply outmatched. I mean, what if I stick up for myself and then the girlfriend market goes into a recession? What if I kick her to the curb and then have to wait over a year, only to end up with small improvements like a girl who is only 30 instead of 50 lbs overweight, or only demands 2 instead of 3 dudes on the side?

Nope. Better to play it safe and take her offer, right? I mean, Im just a second tier kind of guy, with 2nd tier looks, and a second tier car. Its not like Im on the same level as those guys who demand, and somehow receive the respect they deserve.

(This is a work of fiction. It is meant for entertainment purposes only, and any similarities to the mindset of actual unapologetic yes voters, either living or brain-dead, is unintentional and purely coincidental)
Absolutely brilliant! And a good laugh is always a great way to start the day! With that laugh, therein lies much truth.
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Quote: Perhaps I don’t...

Right now, the company makes the sequences and the u ion makes the lines. PBS will do both in that the sequences will be constructed according to parameters set within the programming. Yes?

If so, then whatever the programming allows (or is constrained to) will occur more often.
No. PBS has nothing to do with pairing construction. Whatever system the company has now for creating pairings will remain in place. The company has the final say as to pairing construction and ALPA has no access or input into the process whatsoever.

Right now, ALPA uses line creation software using the pairings the company has created. They unstack (shocking, I know), as necessary, to ensure there aren't an excessive number of open trips all covering the same time period and build the lines to an average line value set by the company.

Under PBS, the company will still create the pairings using whatever software they have to do that. ALPA will have access to the optimizer and input into solving issues. The company will retain final say on the pairings.

With PBS, instead of using its current line building software, ALPA will control the PBS line solution process subject to mutually agreed upon parameter constraints such as target line value (similar to ALV), line construction window, etc. ALPA will likely run multiple line solutions through PBS, tweaking various parameters (within the agreed upon limits) to get an optimal solution, then publish the best solution as the award.

The fact that ALPA is the one responsible for the line solution process is a huge part of the "unknown" part of PBS. At other airlines, it's the company that runs the line solutions and tweaks them with varying amounts of input from ALPA.

Now, will the different rigs, ave min FDP etc influence the pairing construction? Possibly. Hopefully it will encourage the company to schedule more efficiently (although that is somehwat constrained by our current low frequency marketing schedule), but that would happen irrespective of PBS.

Mechanically, PBS just replaces the line building software that ALPA uses to build our lines.
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Sounds like a lot of weak language against a sociopathic management group. Not good. I expected this to be better honestly.
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