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-   -   Hard Sell (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/southwest/145273-hard-sell.html)

FastNeatAvg 12-17-2023 01:58 PM


Originally Posted by e6bpilot (Post 3738173)
This thread is comical. Leaked info from an "insider" has guys arguing about FO pay and casting their no votes already. As someone said on the SWAPA forum, I am a single issue voter and that issue is the whole contract.
It's been 3 years, another week isn't going to kill you.
A sweet widebody pay rate doesn't mean sh!t without the contract language to make it pay. The company could gut language somewhere and give a sweet 767 rate and you chumps would drool all over the same paycheck you would have been getting at a lower rate.
Wait for the actual language.
Make an educated choice.


Do you want to be tarred and feathered? Your logic and reasoning as no power here

Cyio 12-17-2023 02:00 PM


Originally Posted by e6bpilot (Post 3738173)
This thread is comical. Leaked info from an "insider" has guys arguing about FO pay and casting their no votes already. As someone said on the SWAPA forum, I am a single issue voter and that issue is the whole contract.
It's been 3 years, another week isn't going to kill you.
A sweet widebody pay rate doesn't mean sh!t without the contract language to make it pay. The company could gut language somewhere and give a sweet 767 rate and you chumps would drool all over the same paycheck you would have been getting at a lower rate.
Wait for the actual language.
Make an educated choice.

In total agreement as stated earlier. I was just pointing out some irony.

flyguy81 12-17-2023 02:04 PM


Originally Posted by WNPilotMom (Post 3738170)
I wish mommy would've instilled some self worth. How many participation trophys are on your mantel?

zero. I worked for everything I’ve ever earned with 0 help from my parents or anyone else. I’m happy with the choice I’ve made and I’m not going anywhere else. If your kid is happy and self-sufficient, then what do you care? He’s an adult and can make his own decisions.

WNPilotMom 12-17-2023 02:13 PM


Originally Posted by flyguy81 (Post 3738183)
zero. I worked for everything I’ve ever earned with 0 help from my parents or anyone else. I’m happy with the choice I’ve made and I’m not going anywhere else. If your kid is happy and self-sufficient, then what do you care? He’s an adult and can make his own decisions.

Zero help from anyone? That's amazing, maybe impossible.

I care because I want us to continue pushing the career down the field instead of rolling up short and convincing ourselves we make more than x, y or z...because we work MORE than x, y, or z. I'm also very concerned he will turn out like you and be content with good enough. Have some self worth, make your mommy proud.

Profane Kahuna 12-17-2023 02:29 PM


Originally Posted by Cnflys (Post 3738023)
Didn't say I was expecting widebody pay. I said that I expect career compensation at SWA to be as much or more than the industry leaders. Be it a 20, 30, or 40 year career.


Exactly...... only those pilots with little self worth fall for the "narrowbody" pay mental trick.

.

Grumpyaviator 12-17-2023 03:03 PM


Originally Posted by e6bpilot (Post 3738173)
This thread is comical. Leaked info from an "insider" has guys arguing about FO pay and casting their no votes already. As someone said on the SWAPA forum, I am a single issue voter and that issue is the whole contract.
It's been 3 years, another week isn't going to kill you.
A sweet widebody pay rate doesn't mean sh!t without the contract language to make it pay. The company could gut language somewhere and give a sweet 767 rate and you chumps would drool all over the same paycheck you would have been getting at a lower rate.
Wait for the actual language.
Make an educated choice.

I believe the 75 and 76 are the same rate.

flyguy81 12-17-2023 03:31 PM


Originally Posted by WNPilotMom (Post 3738187)
Zero help from anyone? That's amazing, maybe impossible.

I care because I want us to continue pushing the career down the field instead of rolling up short and convincing ourselves we make more than x, y or z...because we work MORE than x, y, or z. I'm also very concerned he will turn out like you and be content with good enough. Have some self worth, make your mommy proud.

Told my parents I wanted to be a pilot. They said, "Good luck....sounds expensive". Didn't give me a cent for college. Worked my tail off to pay for school with as few loans as possible. Went to a regional, paid off $40k in student loans in 5 years. Debt free except for the mortgage. Building a custom home with 0 financial help from anyone.

How is actually achieving industry leading 737 pay for the same guarantee considered rolling up short? I'm not content with good enough....I'm content with industry leading pay for the plane I fly. At the end of the day, if you compare 2,3,4 day trips to OAL's and I make more....I'm content. Right now that's not the case, with this CBA it will be or I'l vote no. My mom is plenty proud, thanks....I make nearly 4x what she does, do a fraction of the work, and have more in my 401k at 42 than she does at 64. Maybe don't treat your kid like they're a complete moron and they might be more responsive to advice you're giving. Or be a spiteful shrew and complain to a bunch of strangers that your kid is an idiot.

Liberty 12-17-2023 03:34 PM


Originally Posted by flyguy81 (Post 3738225)
Told my parents I wanted to be a pilot. They said, "Good luck....sounds expensive". Didn't give me a cent for college. Worked my tail off to pay for school with as few loans as possible. Went to a regional, paid off $40k in student loans in 5 years. Debt free except for the mortgage. Building a custom home with 0 financial help from anyone.

How is actually achieving industry leading 737 pay for the same guarantee considered rolling up short? I'm not content with good enough....I'm content with industry leading pay for the plane I fly. At the end of the day, if you compare 2,3,4 day trips to OAL's and I make more....I'm content. Right now that's not the case, with this CBA it will be or I'l vote no. My mom is plenty proud, thanks....I make nearly 4x what she does, do a fraction of the work, and have more in my 401k at 42 than she does at 64. Maybe don't treat your kid like they're a complete moron and they might be more responsive to advice you're giving. Or be a spiteful shrew and complain to a bunch of strangers that your kid is an idiot.

Okay, no more drinks for this guy! Come on, buddy… let’s step outside and get some cool air. 😂

dsevo 12-17-2023 03:56 PM


Originally Posted by flyguy81 (Post 3738225)
Told my parents I wanted to be a pilot. They said, "Good luck....sounds expensive". Didn't give me a cent for college. Worked my tail off to pay for school with as few loans as possible. Went to a regional, paid off $40k in student loans in 5 years. Debt free except for the mortgage. Building a custom home with 0 financial help from anyone.

How is actually achieving industry leading 737 pay for the same guarantee considered rolling up short? I'm not content with good enough....I'm content with industry leading pay for the plane I fly. At the end of the day, if you compare 2,3,4 day trips to OAL's and I make more....I'm content. Right now that's not the case, with this CBA it will be or I'l vote no. My mom is plenty proud, thanks....I make nearly 4x what she does, do a fraction of the work, and have more in my 401k at 42 than she does at 64. Maybe don't treat your kid like they're a complete moron and they might be more responsive to advice you're giving. Or be a spiteful shrew and complain to a bunch of strangers that your kid is an idiot.

So if you block 600-800 hours per year but your OAL counterparts block 300-400 hours per year at the same # of days worked but considerably less TAFB hours due to late starts and early returns, you consider that making equal money? Your effective hourly rate is getting absolutely destroyed in that scenario.

I’m sure SWA management really appreciates your mental gymnastics to come up with that. Y’all work hard, you should make way more than a few token $/hr on a pay chart compared to OAL. When I compare my SWA friend’s productivity to mine it isn’t even close from an hourly rate standpoint ($/TAFB), though gross is somewhat comparable.

Grumpyaviator 12-17-2023 04:21 PM


Originally Posted by dsevo (Post 3738238)
So if you block 600-800 hours per year but your OAL counterparts block 300-400 hours per year at the same # of days worked but considerably less TAFB hours due to late starts and early returns, you consider that making equal money? Your effective hourly rate is getting absolutely destroyed in that scenario.

I’m sure SWA management really appreciates your mental gymnastics to come up with that. Y’all work hard, you should make way more than a few token $/hr on a pay chart compared to OAL. When I compare my SWA friend’s productivity to mine it isn’t even close from an hourly rate standpoint ($/TAFB), though gross is somewhat comparable.

that’s been the mindset here for too long. “hourly rate is not as important as how much you can really earn”, since the company allows you to work yourself to death…and we have more fun doing it, not.


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