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Two things I was taught by my college baseball coach.Originally Posted by Noconcessions
After about 5K hours, with some PIC, jet, turbine etc, there’s some other reason you’re not at the majors under normal or good hiring conditions. Just saying.
“The only thing you can control is attitude and effort.”
I live everyday by this mantra.
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“The only thing you can control is attitude and effort.”
I live everyday by this mantra.
Hmmm. Pitch and Power. Originally Posted by ChecklistChamp
Two things I was taught by my college baseball coach.“The only thing you can control is attitude and effort.”
I live everyday by this mantra.
at6d
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Over whom? Rotor-wing military pilots? Yes.
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It's hard to tell. You sometimes see f-teen drivers with only a few thousand hours get hired right away (or with 500 hrs and one year at a regional to prove they can fly bigger planes) and then a heavy USAF pilot with many thousands of hours, evaluator time, squadron commander, global air operations into sketchy locations, not even get an interview because of "better qualified" applicants like the handful we've seen here who have a fraction of the flight time and almost no TPIC.Originally Posted by Jetpower
Do fixed-wing military pilots have a leg up on being hired at SWA?
If the mil guys were all getting interviews but then not getting hired, I'd say yea their background might get them preference just to get the interview. But I've seen enough highly experienced mil pilots not even get an interview to think they're not all getting preferential treatment. And of course at the interview, everyone is "qualified" so you gotta fit the mold to get the CJO no matter where you came from.
In fact, I'd say that a "normal" military career progression can actually look bad because the normal periods of non-flying during a typical military career can look very confusing to both HR and pilot interviewers who don't understand how military assignments work. Even the most dedicated pilot is going to spend time non-flying, which on paper may appear to be time out of the business or show a lack of true interest in the flying job. The reality is that mil pilots have very little control over when their non-flying assignments will be, and god help the poor slobs like me who get tagged with a drone job as their last assignment before retirement. You can imagine how that goes with a clueless interviewer... "So, explain to me one more time why you have only 6.9 hours in the last 5 years? An 8 day work week flying 24/7/365 combat ops as a drone pilot sure looks like you're not a real pilot any more, so why exactly do you think you could work here?" I got that from 5 out of 8 hiring teams I talked to, got 1 "get 500 hours anywhere else then re-apply", and I took the better of the 2 who were willing to take a chance hiring me. I'm not sure that amounts to preferential hiring for military pilots.
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Definitely. Their numbers have just dwindled since the mid 2010s, so there aren't that many relative to pure civilian. Originally Posted by Jetpower
Do fixed-wing military pilots have a leg up on being hired at SWA?
Military guys are easy to hire as long as they aren't total dweebs in the interview. They have had a minimum 10 year tryout period in a difficult training and demanding operational environment where you can't just throw a bunch of money at a part 141 school and pass. They have also held security clearances and positions of trust and have all the background checks pre-done. They won't have as many hours, especially now that the forever wars have wound down and the military isn't flush with equipment and cash like they were, but those hours they have count for a lot.
This isn't meant to denigrate anyone from any background. We all know terrible military folks that somehow fooled everyone. We all know amazing civ pilots.
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Military guys are easy to hire as long as they aren't total dweebs in the interview. They have had a minimum 10 year tryout period in a difficult training and demanding operational environment where you can't just throw a bunch of money at a part 141 school and pass. They have also held security clearances and positions of trust and have all the background checks pre-done. They won't have as many hours, especially now that the forever wars have wound down and the military isn't flush with equipment and cash like they were, but those hours they have count for a lot.
This isn't meant to denigrate anyone from any background. We all know terrible military folks that somehow fooled everyone. We all know amazing civ pilots.
Honestly, I think the known quantity gives the military folks the best advantage. It's not really about the elite F22 time, as most of them hired at WN seem to be tanker/cargo pilots, but rather the "OK, we know where and what this person has been doing for the last 10 years, they are not hiding anything and haven't broken any laws". Makes the HR side very easy. Add in the networking the MIL folks have, and it's easy to see why it could be perceived as easier for them.Originally Posted by e6bpilot
Definitely. Their numbers have just dwindled since the mid 2010s, so there aren't that many relative to pure civilian.Military guys are easy to hire as long as they aren't total dweebs in the interview. They have had a minimum 10 year tryout period in a difficult training and demanding operational environment where you can't just throw a bunch of money at a part 141 school and pass. They have also held security clearances and positions of trust and have all the background checks pre-done. They won't have as many hours, especially now that the forever wars have wound down and the military isn't flush with equipment and cash like they were, but those hours they have count for a lot.
This isn't meant to denigrate anyone from any background. We all know terrible military folks that somehow fooled everyone. We all know amazing civ pilots.
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Don’t get wrapped up in military vs civilian. In my opinion the mil guys are great for known quantity stuff—very trainable, etc.
Us civilians should focus on civilian competition because that’s who we are really competing with.
Us civilians should focus on civilian competition because that’s who we are really competing with.
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If the context of your question is “relative to other airlines” then I’d say no.Originally Posted by Jetpower;[url=tel:3974398
3974398[/url]]Do fixed-wing military pilots have a leg up on being hired at SWA?
Southwest more heavily weights hours and recency than other airlines in my unscientific polling of hires compared to legacies.
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Agreed. Even those tanker/C17 hours are hard to come by these days. Guys are leaving a first line/sea tour with 600-700 hours. That used to be unheard of. Originally Posted by Cyio
Honestly, I think the known quantity gives the military folks the best advantage. It's not really about the elite F22 time, as most of them hired at WN seem to be tanker/cargo pilots, but rather the "OK, we know where and what this person has been doing for the last 10 years, they are not hiding anything and haven't broken any laws". Makes the HR side very easy. Add in the networking the MIL folks have, and it's easy to see why it could be perceived as easier for them.
Yeah, the mil is just good for screening red flags/personal issues. The rest is all the same. Someone with 3000 hours and up is going to be the same no matter the background. The first 1000 mil hours are just dense if that makes sense. It isn't just flying from one big airport to another.
I don't think one background is any better than the other as far as making an airline pilot. I just think mil guys get an advantage on job offer day.
