HAHA...politco.....your trusting what politico says???? what planet are you on????? politico says something and you believe it????? classic!!!!!! here's a tip for you, just because some bullsh/t news "blog" says something, doesn't make it true.......

no, he does not think it is a good deal....he want's you to think it is a good deal, and he want's every other employee group to think it's a good deal....see the difference?

What I said is an exaggeration to make a point. Let me break it down for you:

This management team has argued with us over every little thing in our current contract. Language that is black and white, that they agreed upon, is always being "interpreted differently" by them. Of course the way they interpret it always gives us the short end of the stick. Then we grieve it, and eventually we win a court ruling in our favor and the company is forced to stop. So then they find something else to "interpret differently". Let's just say we all have little faith and ZERO trust in our leaders. I have no doubt that pbs, when used properly, is not a bad system... but this is Spirit management we are talking about.

So when the company points out all the other airlines that have pbs and use it successfully, I'd like to respond with the words of our CFO: "yeah, but they run a good airline".

You're right...what's wrong with me? I realize now I should only source my news from Breitbart and Drudge. They are truly the only reliable source of REAL news without any bias whatsoever.

A ramper told me that the reason Spirit and Gojet were even talking with each other in the first place, was that Spirit was interested in buying Gojet. No-one was interested in selling and the end result was this flow program.

No they haven't, which is exactly why you go for iron-clad language. 1) it keeps them honest and GUARANTEES they won't experiment with it, and 2) if they're honest about having no interest or need in code sharing, etc, then it should be a relatively cheap item to obtain, much like furlough protection in a time like this. After all, if they aren't going to need it, why would they not sign off on protective language?

I'm a little lost on the "rumor hierarchy"... Are ramper rumors more or less credible than FA or mechanic rumors? :confused:

I'm not trolling just trying to understand the negotiating process. Serious question:

I think it's safe to say that nobody wants to give up current scheduling practices for PBS. But if PBS is "industry standard" can we realistically attain insdustry standard pay without it? I hope so, but how?

Southwest did. Plus I'll argue this "pbs is industry standard" concept. Pbs was forced on many carriers during bankruptcy. It is viewed as a concession. Industry standard is the status quo when it comes to line bidding vs pbs. No recent contract signed had any change in the way the pilots bid.

Thread drift:
Have the Trans States pilots filled out a ButtHurt report?

Nah they just write gojet girls do it better on the yoke cap.

66% percent discount on our retro pay?! Seriously?! Oh yeah. We're all about the discount at NK.

Interesting. I didn't know they liked tranny's. Looking back their hat pin is a dead giveaway.

He likes it so much he "Leaked" it out for the world to see. Now all employee groups know what greedy pigs we are for turning down this amazing offer. :cool:

Real classy move and a poor attempt to sow discord among your employee groups.

I wonder what the NMB would think of that particular "negotiation tactic?"

Not only that but they sent them to our homes. Im assuming they expect our spouses to open them and somehow be thrilled?

They did? Maybe mine got lost in Irma... which is fine with me.

Mine arrived today

Awesome!! Can't wait to use it as toilet paper.

Haha. Mine is probably sitting in a pile on the kitchen table. When I told my wife the company's offer, her reply was "you aren't going to vote yes on that are you?". I explained to her that our MEC is smart enough to send that sh!+pile of an offer out for a vote.

When the company starts going around the union and appealing directly to the employees,........ you've won.

Don't blow it.

I had a good experience with PBS overall at my last job but I think we were definitely an exception to the rule. I'm not opposed to the idea of PBS but at my seniority and based on what I've been able to work out with creative bidding over the past 3 months I figure I'd need at least a $20/hour raise with it just to match what I make now. Factoring that into the equation "industry standard" would have to also include DL/UA/AA rates to offset the loss of line bidding for me.

Don't forget the work rules ....... they shape the trips that allow PBS to be palatable.

UALs scheduling section in our contract is the biggest section. There is a reason why. With PBS - crap in / you get crap out.

PBS will limit your schedule flexibility, open time and require less pilots which means less captains. Just saying from my past experience.

Nothing like going around the Union and going to each Pilot. Does the Union think this is OK? It under mines us as a group. I'll stick with my Union brothers and sisters! The NC speaks for me, return to sender! Don't open it. Toss it in the trash. :cool:

Yeah I'm quite weary of PBS and that's why I said it's gonna take bringing us up towards DL/UA/AA rates and rules for me to even consider it. We had a workable PBS system when I was with XJT (ASA) but I'm pretty sure that anything that Spirit might end up with will likely have been programmed by some 21 year old dude in his parent's basement and purchased for $15, a voucher for a free coke anywhere Spirit flies, and a platinum subscription to PornHub.

unfortunately the national mediation does not care one iota......

I rewrote it for what it needs to be for me to vote yes, and mailed it back to Bendo :p

Certified mail so they have to sign for it. Better yet, C.O.D!

i support my MEC and NC
 

Triple 666 is right on the money. PBS and no industry standard is a joke. Now we don't need to negotiate here, that is up to the NC so I will continue to stay off the forums. I will however comment on one other item. In a previous life while involved in other contract negotiations (not ruled by RLA) a company communicating directly to employees (while and under contract negotiations) and bypassing the union was a clear unfair labor practice (ULP) a big no no. Why it is allowed here I don't know.

you mean winning like the northwest mechanics? then yes

He broke them SG. We're far from broken. Or did you miss the part about 100% strike authorization from 97% of eligible voters, a direct vote of support for our NC?

listen, just gonna say it once. no matter how good the pbs language is written, it will be followed. it will be years of arbitration before it is enforced. fly it and grieve it, that's alpa's mantra. you have to realize that.....tell your friends....ask the old timers how long it took to enforce the transition language of the current contract.

yes, and in a few years i will proudly walk the line

I understand the frustration and am right there with you. But don't come on a public forum and lend to the notion that Bendo is breaking our union, because nothing could be further from the truth.

why, is there a private forum i can join???

Geez dude, you're like talking to a nutty Brazilian girlfriend.

"no matter how good the pbs language is written, it will be followed."


Say again?


I'm not advocating for PBS here. Quite the contrary. I said I'd want to see legacy rates before I'd even consider it because PBS would cost me the equivalent of about $20 per hour in lost credit.

JetBlue/Allegiant rates + PBS = Hard no. I trust our NC to keep that in mind and will be sure to remind them if they happen to forget.

You sir are wrong.
 

Ok so I had to chime in here. There is not a single Regional airline that you will go to that will not have guys struggling there first couple of sims. Its simple these are or at least should be guys with zero jet experience. Spirit on the other hand should be guys that have jet time that should be qualified enough to make it through a training event.

Furthermore, I would like to say GoJet only gets 3 sims when you upgrade. There are and will always be people that pass and fail when going to Captain and in case you didn't know when doing initial at Spirit.

Do not try to look down upon individuals at GoJet because you believe inexperience at a regional is at only one regional because your wrong.

Also I understand there is bad blood between GoJet and TSA, but to act like people that came here 5-10 years later should be blamed, I do not agree. There are other regional airlines have taken concessions not just GoJet.



On a side note guys I am really happy to see yal sticking it out until you can get a contract. I was hoping to join your team in the future. Good luck and get what you deserve.

i give up/////