Some valid points and I won't say you're wrong. But any legacy has the ability to eventually bid out of an airplane. And I don't know where you're sitting but CA line holders are very, very senior. If Spirit continues to add and grow other bases while letting existing bases stagnate then one may be better off at a legacy with record retirements coming versus sitting in the bottom sludge for another decade.

I think anyone coming to NK now, who has options somewhere else, is a damn fool. Even with anticipated growth the time to come here has come and gone. And I feel the same way about WN only years ago. Not everyone can get to a legacy and I have no idea if I could either. But, if the future is being an Alaska or Southwest pilot for decades to come for 75% of the pay then I may very well put my best foot forward and try to go somewhere else.

 

First of all, this discussion started in regards to your comment about wanting to leave if you had to fly a 737 (yawn). It wasnt about newhires. However....

Someone here would gain similar relative seniority in the next 3 years with our growth then they would over the next 7-10 at a legacy with 13000+ pilots with 500 retirements a year. Im not saying its perfect here, (it isnt anywhere). Someone "with options" needs to evaluate whats best for them and make the best of it. For me, staying here works great, and going to a legacy would work great too. I wouldnt ever call anyone a fool for staying here if they had options or not. Everyone has their own reasons for the choices they make. Starting over at any legacy would still potentially take many years to get back to the same seniority and or pay unless you are new hire, (especially true for senior FO's and Capts) and our growth is extremely attractive, just like retirements. Many of our pilots dont have the time left to restart at an another airline, or they simply enjoy their current seniority and schedule. There is nothing wrong with that.

Capt line holders very very senior? lol. the vast majority of our airline has been here under 10 years. Think about that....

 

27 more used 321s will be entering the market shortly.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-49791249

 

Over 1300 pilots at spirit are under 45 years old. That's over 55%. If growth slows or stops, it's a grind ahead. Especially given the FO pay gap is far larger than the captain's gap. Food for thought... What's the percentage of pilots that will retire at the legacies in the next twenty years?

 

Thomas Cook and Condor.

https://www.businessinsider.com/thomas-cook-bankrupt-airline-stranded-rescue-2019-9

 

Everyone leave Macjet alone...
I think that he is senior to me!

 

No one should or would come here if they had an offer from a legacy unless possibly they’re really tied to living in a Spirit base. I don’t think anyone is arguing this is “better” all things being equal. That’s why most attrition at Spirit comes from the bottom. Doesn’t take a brain surgeon or rocket scientist to figure that dynamic out.

I came here because I thought I’d rather get stuck here than at my regional. I know it’s taboo to say that and compare it to a regional but I upgraded quickly and now I’m not leaving. If Delta or United called when I was a junior FO I probably would have left but they didn’t... I still have friends I went through new hire training with at the regionals waiting for that call making 2/3 less and working more days.

It’s respectable that they’re waiting on their dream job though...

 

This right here. It's almost never a question of having a choice between Spirit and a legacy like you guys are hypothesizing. It's almost always a question of coming to Spirit or staying at a regional. I feel that choice is pretty clear.

 

Yeah not always. A friend of mine had a class date at UPS and came to Spirit instead. As far as he is concerned it’s the best decision he has ever made. I have also met people who chose NK over AK, HA and JB. Go back to trashing Spirit now...

 

I thought I was the only one thinking that...
Even if he's not, at least his curmudgeon attitude won't be missed.