MOCK BIDS NAVBLUE PBS 70percentile
02-13-2019, 07:18 PM
#151
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 4,603
The problem is with it waivable it puts you at a disadvantage to those that waive (assuming you want to be a line holder). The system is going to solve to 4% open time no matter what. So basically if you don’t waive and there are not enough pairings left to build you a line without giving you 4 days off you will go to rsv and a guy that would’ve held rsv but is willing to waive got your line to solve to the 4% open time eventhough the contract says we all should get 4 days off.
Now had those senior to you not waived the system would have pairings available to you that it wouldn’t have had otherwise thus putting you on a level playing field and you would get a line assuming your other preferences didn’t restrict the pairing count too far.
The 4 days off is a real problem in pbs unless we all are required to use it.
15/16 days off min for the bid period would solve all of this while still preserving the spirit of 4 days off
Now had those senior to you not waived the system would have pairings available to you that it wouldn’t have had otherwise thus putting you on a level playing field and you would get a line assuming your other preferences didn’t restrict the pairing count too far.
The 4 days off is a real problem in pbs unless we all are required to use it.
15/16 days off min for the bid period would solve all of this while still preserving the spirit of 4 days off
02-13-2019, 07:45 PM
#152
Line Holder
Joined APC: Aug 2018
Posts: 30
Originally Posted by Qotsaautopilot
The problem is with it waivable it puts you at a disadvantage to those that waive (assuming you want to be a line holder). The system is going to solve to 4% open time no matter what. So basically if you don’t waive and there are not enough pairings left to build you a line without giving you 4 days off you will go to rsv and a guy that would’ve held rsv but is willing to waive got your line to solve to the 4% open time eventhough the contract says we all should get 4 days off.
Now had those senior to you not waived the system would have pairings available to you that it wouldn’t have had otherwise thus putting you on a level playing field and you would get a line assuming your other preferences didn’t restrict the pairing count too far.
The 4 days off is a real problem in pbs unless we all are required to use it.
15/16 days off min for the bid period would solve all of this while still preserving the spirit of 4 days off
Now had those senior to you not waived the system would have pairings available to you that it wouldn’t have had otherwise thus putting you on a level playing field and you would get a line assuming your other preferences didn’t restrict the pairing count too far.
The 4 days off is a real problem in pbs unless we all are required to use it.
15/16 days off min for the bid period would solve all of this while still preserving the spirit of 4 days off
Nailed it!!
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02-14-2019, 05:10 AM
#154
Line holder
Joined APC: Nov 2013
Position: On the bus,seat 0A
Posts: 3,228
Originally Posted by Qotsaautopilot
The problem is with it waivable it puts you at a disadvantage to those that waive (assuming you want to be a line holder). The system is going to solve to 4% open time no matter what. So basically if you don’t waive and there are not enough pairings left to build you a line without giving you 4 days off you will go to rsv and a guy that would’ve held rsv but is willing to waive got your line to solve to the 4% open time eventhough the contract says we all should get 4 days off.
Now had those senior to you not waived the system would have pairings available to you that it wouldn’t have had otherwise thus putting you on a level playing field and you would get a line assuming your other preferences didn’t restrict the pairing count too far.
The 4 days off is a real problem in pbs unless we all are required to use it.
15/16 days off min for the bid period would solve all of this while still preserving the spirit of 4 days off
Now had those senior to you not waived the system would have pairings available to you that it wouldn’t have had otherwise thus putting you on a level playing field and you would get a line assuming your other preferences didn’t restrict the pairing count too far.
The 4 days off is a real problem in pbs unless we all are required to use it.
15/16 days off min for the bid period would solve all of this while still preserving the spirit of 4 days off
02-14-2019, 06:03 AM
#155
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2015
Posts: 188
I am bidder 138 in base and our base has 138 lines. I tried to bid a line with 4 days off min and 5 days on max. No joy. Impossible to meet credit window. Cascaded all the way down to 2 days off min before PBS would give me a line. If I did not waive the minimum days I would have been awarded a reserve line.
So, for some of us, the only way to get any line flying is to waive the min days. And, unfortunately, in order to have ANY schedule flexibility, one has to be awarded line flying, since reserve flexibility is literally non-existent under PBS.
I can't speak for anyone else, but the number one reason I came to Spirit in 2014 was the schedule flexibility. I saw it being given away during contract 2018 while I was sitting on reserve, which is the number one reason I voted no. I wanted to get back to the table to preserve the QOL for our reservists. Luckily, we have this option to waive the min days to give otherwise junior reservists the ability to retain some schedule flexibility. Sorry if I lack any empathy for senior pilots that are unwilling to waive min days off in order to get more of what they want. Some of us have to do it just to be able to participate in IOT and DOT in order to swing a needed day off every now and then.
So, for some of us, the only way to get any line flying is to waive the min days. And, unfortunately, in order to have ANY schedule flexibility, one has to be awarded line flying, since reserve flexibility is literally non-existent under PBS.
I can't speak for anyone else, but the number one reason I came to Spirit in 2014 was the schedule flexibility. I saw it being given away during contract 2018 while I was sitting on reserve, which is the number one reason I voted no. I wanted to get back to the table to preserve the QOL for our reservists. Luckily, we have this option to waive the min days to give otherwise junior reservists the ability to retain some schedule flexibility. Sorry if I lack any empathy for senior pilots that are unwilling to waive min days off in order to get more of what they want. Some of us have to do it just to be able to participate in IOT and DOT in order to swing a needed day off every now and then.
02-14-2019, 10:14 AM
#156
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2011
Posts: 657
Originally Posted by Keizer Soze
I am bidder 138 in base and our base has 138 lines. I tried to bid a line with 4 days off min and 5 days on max. No joy. Impossible to meet credit window. Cascaded all the way down to 2 days off min before PBS would give me a line. If I did not waive the minimum days I would have been awarded a reserve line.
So, for some of us, the only way to get any line flying is to waive the min days. And, unfortunately, in order to have ANY schedule flexibility, one has to be awarded line flying, since reserve flexibility is literally non-existent under PBS.
I can't speak for anyone else, but the number one reason I came to Spirit in 2014 was the schedule flexibility. I saw it being given away during contract 2018 while I was sitting on reserve, which is the number one reason I voted no. I wanted to get back to the table to preserve the QOL for our reservists. Luckily, we have this option to waive the min days to give otherwise junior reservists the ability to retain some schedule flexibility. Sorry if I lack any empathy for senior pilots that are unwilling to waive min days off in order to get more of what they want. Some of us have to do it just to be able to participate in IOT and DOT in order to swing a needed day off every now and then.
So, for some of us, the only way to get any line flying is to waive the min days. And, unfortunately, in order to have ANY schedule flexibility, one has to be awarded line flying, since reserve flexibility is literally non-existent under PBS.
I can't speak for anyone else, but the number one reason I came to Spirit in 2014 was the schedule flexibility. I saw it being given away during contract 2018 while I was sitting on reserve, which is the number one reason I voted no. I wanted to get back to the table to preserve the QOL for our reservists. Luckily, we have this option to waive the min days to give otherwise junior reservists the ability to retain some schedule flexibility. Sorry if I lack any empathy for senior pilots that are unwilling to waive min days off in order to get more of what they want. Some of us have to do it just to be able to participate in IOT and DOT in order to swing a needed day off every now and then.
02-14-2019, 11:01 AM
#157
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,464
Doom and gloom doom and gloom!
Dear God we have so many 6 day block lines that nobody wants. I don't see anyone here complaining about that huh.
Because here's what we do: WE DROP
Guess what guys? All that is still here. IOT/DOT to your hearts content.
And the kicker is 4% of open time will be in IOT, compared to the required 0 % of now.
As for the guy who said it must solve to 4%, that's not true. If it cannot build lines it won't. They'll try to solve to 4% but it cannot disregard CBA limitations.
If no one waives 4 off, there will be WAY more than 4% (without RLL lines, which mock bids are not doing and we don't have the Mou rll numbers yet)
Dear God we have so many 6 day block lines that nobody wants. I don't see anyone here complaining about that huh.
Because here's what we do: WE DROP
Guess what guys? All that is still here. IOT/DOT to your hearts content.
And the kicker is 4% of open time will be in IOT, compared to the required 0 % of now.
As for the guy who said it must solve to 4%, that's not true. If it cannot build lines it won't. They'll try to solve to 4% but it cannot disregard CBA limitations.
If no one waives 4 off, there will be WAY more than 4% (without RLL lines, which mock bids are not doing and we don't have the Mou rll numbers yet)
02-14-2019, 11:21 AM
#158
escaped
Joined APC: Aug 2011
Posts: 227
Originally Posted by flyingpuma1
My qol has already started to tank here on reserve and now I live in a base but am commuting to another to try and stay off reserve when this crap (pbs) kicks in. I have little sympathy for anyone who voted for this and doesn't like it now....
At 40s% on the left, I wish for everyone senior to me to get their desired schedule without waiving the 4 days off
If ALPA restricts us from waiving in 6 months, it would be the greatest disservice to our membership,
since "contract18" and LMS LOA!
02-14-2019, 08:55 PM
#159
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 4,603
Originally Posted by elmetal
Doom and gloom doom and gloom!
Dear God we have so many 6 day block lines that nobody wants. I don't see anyone here complaining about that huh.
Because here's what we do: WE DROP
Guess what guys? All that is still here. IOT/DOT to your hearts content.
And the kicker is 4% of open time will be in IOT, compared to the required 0 % of now.
As for the guy who said it must solve to 4%, that's not true. If it cannot build lines it won't. They'll try to solve to 4% but it cannot disregard CBA limitations.
If no one waives 4 off, there will be WAY more than 4% (without RLL lines, which mock bids are not doing and we don't have the Mou rll numbers yet)
Dear God we have so many 6 day block lines that nobody wants. I don't see anyone here complaining about that huh.
Because here's what we do: WE DROP
Guess what guys? All that is still here. IOT/DOT to your hearts content.
And the kicker is 4% of open time will be in IOT, compared to the required 0 % of now.
As for the guy who said it must solve to 4%, that's not true. If it cannot build lines it won't. They'll try to solve to 4% but it cannot disregard CBA limitations.
If no one waives 4 off, there will be WAY more than 4% (without RLL lines, which mock bids are not doing and we don't have the Mou rll numbers yet)
02-14-2019, 09:09 PM
#160
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 4,603
Originally Posted by Jett i son
It was the RETRO $$$...
At 40s% on the left, I wish for everyone senior to me to get their desired schedule without waiving the 4 days off
If ALPA restricts us from waiving in 6 months, it would be the greatest disservice to our membership,
since "contract18" and LMS LOA!
At 40s% on the left, I wish for everyone senior to me to get their desired schedule without waiving the 4 days off
If ALPA restricts us from waiving in 6 months, it would be the greatest disservice to our membership,
since "contract18" and LMS LOA!
More min days off was the key and we missed the opportunity unless we remove the ability to waive and the company and ALPA want to LOA more min days off mid cycle or we wait until 2023.
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