CBreezy

The above is kind of correct. There is no stipend. It's just paid straight at 60 hours per month until the completion of IOE (IOE block counts toward the guarantee). I don't know where that stipend came from.

Nevets

Someone has already done this. I've posted the link here before for comparison. Its on this thread: http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/re...-glance-4.html

But to answer your hypothetical, over the span of 20 years, the TSA pilot will make $38,563 more or $1,928 more per year over 20 years. If you look at the chart, you can do the manual math for years less than 20 but it wont be able to take into account total compensation since you will only be able to add the wages only. Suffice it to say that in your scenario, the XJT pilot doesn't start catching up until year 7. So that's a testament to what I've been saying all along, that the TSA contract is average and when compared to the XJT contract, its obviously so. You can talk about upgrade times and that is legitimate. But at the same time upgrade times can change on a whim whereas a contract cannot. Which is why I choose not to speculate on upgrade times, just the black and white of contracts.

Also, there are many assumptions taken into that chart such as 1000 hours credit, 4000 hours TAFB, and no cost of insurance cost sharing, which can make a huge difference in your contract.

Its probably just old information. I dug this out from a thread that started in 2008. Thanks for the correction.

flyingreasemnky

So what Expressjet has is duty day guarantee and not leg by leg cancellation pay. At Trans States if you cancel, you do not lose your block or better for the day because it is real leg by leg cancellation pay.

Here is what Leg by Leg Cancellation pay reads like:

TSA CBA Section 3:
"F. Cancellation Pay

On a leg-by-leg basis, a regular or build-up pilot who has a trip, or portion thereof, cancelled or involuntarily removed from his schedule after the publication of the Final Master for any reason other than his own illness, injury, leave of absence, retirement, training failure or delay, suspension, termination or failure to report, will be paid and credited his actual flight pay hours or scheduled flight pay hours, whichever is greater. If a premium leg is removed or canceled, except for the reasons listed above, the pilot will receive premium pay and credit for the scheduled flight pay hours for that leg. For purposes of this paragraph, “schedule” includes all trips for which a pilot is responsible regardless of the method by which he is assigned or awarded the trip. Once a trip is assigned, it is part of a pilot’s schedule."


There is no MOU or LOA for Captain Qualified First Officer as it is in the CBA. Below is an excerpt from the CBA. I have already posted in regards to the compensation but here is a link to it: http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/re...ml#post1779929

TSA CBA Section 24:
"H. Captain Qualified First Officer (“CQFO”)

1. The Company shall meet with the Association and discuss staffing requirements prior to hiring CQFOs rather than filling vacancies from the seniority list.

2. The Company will continue to train (upgrade and transition) qualified pilots at a minimum of one percent (1%) of pilots in the aircraft fleet or four (4) pilots, whichever is greater, per training class with a minimum of one (1) training class per calendar quarter with an overall minimum of six (6) training classes per calendar year until such time as all the CQFOs have been returned to bidding for first officer lines of flying.

3. Any qualified pilot held in his position due to the hiring of a CQFO shall be entitled to the protections in paragraph I., below.

I. When a qualified pilot is bypassed for a vacancy award due to the operational needs of the Company, the bypassed pilot shall be paid and credited based on the rate of pay of the bypassed position and the credit he actually earns. No bypass shall exceed six (6) months. A bypass shall be considered to begin on the sixtieth (60th) day after the commencement of the class in question."

Nevets

Thanks for that. I appreciate it. As for the leg for leg cancellation, duly noted.

SpeedTaped

Fixed it for you bud.

Point being this is all your opinion and not necessarily the group consensus. Points in your contract vs. TSA's may carry more weight for a particular individual. A commuting pilot may think TSA's contract is better and a non commuting pilot may think XJ's contract is better. This is all in the eye of the beholder. Your not convincing anyone that you are right on this forum just displaying your inability to see the big picture.

Speed

Nevets

On the contrary. I've changed my position when I've been shown where I had bad or missing information. Yes, I have my opinion but I'm actually backing it up with real information for others to based theirs on. And I've purposely stayed away from things like upgrade time and commuting because those really are subjective and depends on whats happening today (upgrade) and where you live (commuting). Whereas the contract is what it is independent of those things. I'll leave that up to the reader to decide for themselves.

SpeedTaped

Where your contact is independent of those things? Most CBA language most certainly includes both upgrade and commuting. Real factors and real people and they are making real decisions based on what is important to them. Like upgrade and commuting.

Coneydog

At the Hilton we've been staying in at CVG?? You have got to be kidding me. We finally get a real nice hotel with plenty of places to eat around it, and people complain. That's great. So, now it's back to the Holiday Inn with no places to eat. And are we really going back to that Clarion Inn (GRR)?? That place is a complete dump...maybe the worst we stay at. What was wrong with the Crown Plaza?

minimwage4

The clarion is a dump but at least there's lots of stuff around it. With the crown you had to take the van to go anywhere. Still it was good though. I'm wondering why were going back to the old hotel in Mem? What was wrong with the new one?

24/48

Have any of you TSA'ers wondered what the long term future is for the 50 seat jet? Some of you seem to be jumping for joy over this perceived growth and consumed by the immediate future. Meanwhile you poo-poo Mesa, Go-jet, whoever for crap contracts, pilots going there because of shiny new jets, etc. When in reality all I've seen on this thread is a bunch of TSA pilots, good folks I'm sure, jumping for joy over shiny well used jets of the 50 seat variety. All the while throwing contract language, pay rates, benefits, etc on the table trying to one up each other.

Seriously, what do you guys have to be proud of at TSA? Yeah you guys are finally getting out of the gutter and seeing movement. But wasn't it just over 10 years ago the Hulas ***** slapped you with GoJets? This wasn't the first time a sleazy regional CEO did this, anyone remember the original Freedom Air? Same idea as GoJets but forced upon the Mesa pilots, however, the Mesa pilots actually did something about it and it wasn't just coming on a message board to bash Freedom. Mesa used negotiating capital to bring the Freedom Air flying back to the Mesa pilots and it was all done in the post 9/11 airline arena that sucked a$$. So crap on the Mesa contract all you want, but it doesn't mean you guys are winning by any stretch of the imagination.

Back to the 50 seater. Straight up, it's a dying breed. So rejoice all you want but those with the 70/76 seat flying are the long-term survivors in this game. UAL is maintaining the position that a 50 seat jet has a place in our route system, however, they are also banking on our MEC caving more on scope and relaxing some of the block hour restrictions, sorry not interested. What I suspect will happen is that as the 50 seaters come up for heavy maintenance they will be put to pasture. Fact is that UAL wants the max allowable 70/76 seat aircraft per the UPA. With that desire comes tighter block hour restrictions for UAX at 68% UAX Block Hours to UAL Narrow Body Block Hours. With that they can have a total of 325 70/76 airframes, and 450 total airframes (125 50 seaters). 68% spread over 450 airframes will most likely lead to lower than desired aircraft utilization. Oh yeah, and they need to introduce a NEW small narrow body fleet to the mainline.

UAL is actively seeking out a 90 seat aircraft for mainline to fly. That 90 seat aircraft will most likely re-claim the heavier, longer stage length legs like IAH-YEG, BDL, etc freeing up the UAX airframes for shorter stage length legs and growing smaller markets. Those smaller markets would be the markets that the 50 seater currently operates to, a trickle down if you will. Management is championing these new 70/76 seat jets coming on line because they offer the same exact product as mainline with First Class, Econ Plus, and eventually wi-fi entertainment building up the ancillary income those products provide. No such investment is or will be made to the 50 seaters.

So enjoy those "new" airplanes being transferred to you from another regional but don't think it is long term growth you are seeing.