AlettaOcean

I’m at TK for CA Charm School. Scott was here in person to address the new hire class and our class in person.

Observations:

I’d never met him, but I think he legitimately wants UAL to be THE Powerhouse airline. He has the guts and the vision to really bring us where we all want to be. So, thumbs up there. His enthusiasm appears to me to be real and he was, I thought, very honest. He says the LIMFAC on us becoming the behemoth he wants us to be is training capacity. He desperately wants to expand it rapidly. (He didn’t say it, but that obviously gives ALPA HUGE Leverage.)

A few paraphrases of things he said WRT the TA:

1) The deal was done in 4 weeks. He called Mike Hamilton and said, “Let’s get this done.” (My take: amazing how quickly the company will strike a deal when they need something.)

2) He saw it as an opportunity to get more $$ into pilots’ pockets sooner.

3) He acknowledged there were a lot of things in it that were “burrs under the saddle.”

4) He said if he’d realized there’d be such negative response on items such as 10 AM Report and TK Instructors, he’d have done those (and other clauses) differently.

5) He said he hoped it passed because the constraint right now is TK Capacity

6) I then asked him if it didn’t pass, would there be a quick return to the bargaining table to fix it. He said that it was pretty much up to ALPA. If ALPA insists on an entire re-do, it probably wouldn’t happen quickly. But if ALPA is willing to address the major items that pilots find objectionable and not start from scratch, it could happen quickly.

My Two Cents:

United has a historic opportunity, but the company “needs” us to make it happen.
The competition for pilots in the industry is fierce (Scott said this more or less.)
That means We Pilots have a historic opportunity to get much closer back to wages, benefits and working conditions we had before bankruptcy.
We should NOT Fear voting this down. (The sense I got is the Company and MEC are already talking and contingency planning for a NO vote.)
Either way, things will be ok - but I think the company’s ready to really open its wallet to make sure UAL is the first choice of new hires.
Kudos to him for not trying to give us a BS sell job.
If anyone else was there today, please chime in with anything I may have missed, thanks!

*Copied from another forum*

AlettaOcean

1) Sounds like Kirby was writing what he wanted and passing it across the table for the NC to sign.

2) Don’t believe his crocodile tears when he says he’d have done those clauses differently. He wrote them to his extreme advantage in the hopes they would pass.

3) As I suspected, this TA is to fix Kirby’s PI problem. Hamilton would have fixed it via LOA/MOU already, but he couldn’t without opening the whole CBA.

We’re fixing the PI problem, but giving away so much else it’s costing Kirby nothing. If anything, he’s coming out ahead.

Hedley

Kirby hasn’t failed us with this TA. He’s doing exactly what he’s expected to do. He represents United Airlines and the shareholders, therefore his job is to manage cost and maximize profits. It is the MEC who has failed us by accepting this agreement and sending it out to vote. Kirby is doing his job, our union isn’t.

Having said that, I believe Kirby when he says that training is the constraint. He needs to attract and retain instructors and LCA’s to make his big expansion possible. He also knows that this can be quickly fixed and that 50.1% will vote yes if there are some fixes. If they bump the pay rates to cover inflation, no 0600 show for reserves, possibly make field standby or early shows optional with add pay if bid, maintain current widebody rules and landings class, pay LCA’s by the trip rather than the leg, and keep our current reassignment rules, this thing will pass. Basically if he increases the rates on our current book and makes changes to reserve rules he’ll get enough to pass, attract and retain instructors, and possibly fill captain vacancies. We want all of that plus retirement, sick leave accrual, vacation pay……….., but he knows that the majority will vote for less, and when polled the majority will provide ALPA with marching orders saying the same.

jerryleber

That is hilariously disingenuous.
This is called LEVERAGE.

Vote NO to this horrendous TA.

fadec

Starting with the current TA is a no-go. The vote will show it. I'm certainly in no rush to fix Kirby's training problems.

Mudge

Vote no for anything less than a 40% pay increase and an authorized beard.

Excargodog

This is today’s reality:



Anybody voting to accept a concessionary contract that DOES NOT EVEN OFFSET INFLATION is voting to cut the wages of themselves and their fellow pilots. Any union reps recommending such contracts need to be replaced by someone who actually understands the purpose of a union. It’s as simple as that.

Send the quislings who bought into this back to the line. They’ve been paid too much to not work for too long.

Gooselives

you could have a pay raise Friday. If it doesn’t pass and alpa elects to start from scratch plan on no deal for a long time

Excargodog

You just took a 9.1% cut in pay from a year ago. Your concessionary contract will not restore that. How many of those cuts do you believe the pilots ought to allow?

UofM

Jesus. This can’t be real. You’re joking right?