Floyd

Excellent point and goes to how bad do they want the job?

Airhoss

When I was teaching on the 756 the number one thing that new hires had trouble with was the FMS. That is hugely United’s fault because they don’t have a good program to teach the FMS from a zero knowledge basis. On the 756 fleet they expect you to know the basics of the FMS when you show up. The 756 was a horrible new hire fleet.

TK used to have several FMS trainers. There were several FMS set up in a room with simple to follow instructions and you could play with them all you wanted. AFAIK they are gone and replaced with computer based training.

I had several single seat mil guys come through who hadn’t the slightest clue how to run a read and response checklist. Every once in a while poor stick and rudder skills rear their ugly head.

As mentioned previously if you know your flows, profiles and call outs everything else tends to fall into place. Attitude, if you’ve got a good one, the people in the training center will bend over backwards and go the extra mile to help you out. If you’ve got a bad attitude you’ll find the FTC to be a very difficult place.

I never had a new hire with a bad attitude but I heard some stories.

APC225

...or the money. Hourly workers can’t do much better.

IAHB756

I instructed on the 756 fleet as well at the time of the merger. Our transition course (lCAL) was actually called the “Glass transition course” due to the fact that most of the pilots transitioning to the 757 fleet when the syllabus was written were from the MD-80. The MD-80 paid higher than the 737 at the time as the vast majority of the 737 fleet was -300/-500 with the -800’s being “new” and many from the MD-80 were actually refugees from the DC-10 that had been parked a few years earlier. Senior group that thought the 757/767 would be a good soft landing for them in IAH and EWR. The 737 training program even back then was not held in the highest esteem....(the 737-300, when first introduced and separate from the -100/200 had been called “the terminator “ due to the FMC). The FTD-A periods were death by FMC procedures and flows. Somewhere along the way it was decided that everyone had FMC experience and the basics were condensed into what you probably dealt with after 2011.

oldmako

My first 757 class was the worst training I have ever received at U.
I was a 27 Steam Gauge guy so I was WAY behind the plane on day one. Yes, I read a whole ton before I ever got to TK. Back then the company would FedEx you all the manuals and syllabus well before you went to Denver. So, I had a good idea of the systems, flows, callouts, and profiles. But, the footprint to learn the box was about three days long. Of course, I am exaggerating, but it was too damn short. Anything to save a buck!

What really chapped my ass is that I was there, ready, willing and able to waste HOURS of my free time in the FMC procedures trainer in an attempt to get ahead of the curve. But it was dead. That was a LONG time ago but I remember being incredibly frustrated with U at that time.

I was paired with another FO who had SOME glass and FMC time so that was a big help, but not enough.

Then, we got a different instructor every few days and there was very little continuity between them. My partner took copious notes and wasn't shy about raising the bull**** flag when we got dinged. She'd pull out her notes and show what we were "taught" just a few days prior. We even had to go through this crap during the oral portion of our MV! It was farcical. SOP? Yeah, whatever.

We eventually wandered into the fleet guys' office to politely air some of our grievances. The No 2 or 3 guy threw it back in our faces, suggesting that WE weren't doing enough studying even though we were busting our asses. He also completely contradicted what was written in the training syllabus, and more than once. Again she popped out her notes. "You need to know the Captians Flows!" "Uh, not according to this in the syllabus". Wasn't that a happy day. It was the only time at TK I ever felt like I wasn't the customer.

It sucked from start to finish.

Since then, I have been to TK for 5 full transition courses and the training and instructors have been excellent, 95 percent of the time. But when I hear someone had a hard time at TK, I give them a little benefit of the doubt.

John Carr

As far as the high time CA’s from one specific airline......

.......I “heard” many of them where round 1 fail/round 2 pass types.

Sad part is, some were given an interview when under OTS criteria they wouldn’t even have been selected for hogan. And like many others, did the prep and got through the interview.

Meanwhile, they shot down so many GOOD PILOTS.

Anyway, back on topic. 1000TPIC ain’t what it used to be....

DarkSideMoon

I don’t think most companies care about your flying ability as long as you’re competent or better.

They’d likely rather hire an average pilot that seems like a well rounded, hard-working, stable individual than someone with chuck yeager skills but doesn’t play well with others.

KC135

You must not have heard of the CPP flight instructors starting class recently. CFI to UAL 320 or 737, 0 turbine time.

mmm123

Been going on for a long time at United.

Aviatorr

Yup this is the problem and what happens when guys flow/cpp in vs guys who work their butts off to get here and have always wanted to be here.