XHooker

True... but... this might be a slight exception. Nobody has any idea what the recovery will look like, so there might be some willingness on the company's part to carry A FEW more of those fixed costs per pilot than they normally would in order to maintain some upwards flexibility. As you point out, normally a company wants to keep block hours per pilot as high as possible to keep the fixed costs per block hour as low as possible, but these aren't normal times, even by furlough standards.

Charlie Buster

Exactly. SK has said from the beginning and reiterated again in his video today that he wants to preserve the “ability to bounce back”. This obviously means carrying slightly more on the books who are current and qualified. VOLUNTARY reductions might be palatable to some out there like the ESRLs and enable a win win to reduce the overall F number. NO changes to UPA, simply another option to create more flexibility as so much remains unknown.

globetruck

I’m a 2008 hire and #9500 in CCS. That 7 years got me a lot. Kinda like the next 7 years is going to be.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

duvie

line guarantee vs pay rates are two very different things, so to lump them in the same sentence is very unhelpful. One has obvious benefits to one side only... one is undesirable to both in good times and desirable to management right now and desirable to pilots who care about the unity of this pilot group. And before you say you’re junior and leaving, it’s just a statement that you’re taking care of your own stuff and let the others sink or swim on their own. Nothing wrong with that idea, I just think we are a UNION for a reason.

what does this incomplete thought mean? That we shouldn’t explore ways to make this more painful on the company? That the contract as is doesn’t require any improvement? Our contract was not written with a downturn and (potential) upturn like this in mind. As evidenced by both our union and upper management, maybe there are areas/LOAs we can look at that would be acceptable to both parties in the event we get a “V” shaped recovery.

And this is just lazy. I’m not willing to categorically shut off my mind to a staffing strategy that would keep more of us on property. I’m losing my CA seat, that is a virtual certainty and I highly doubt I’ll get furloughed, but there are hundreds of pilots, including many of whom I flew with in the last year, who will not have to take bad flying jobs (if they can find them), be away from their kids a ton, and ultimately come back to UAL (understandably) ****ed off and miserable to be around. I will risk the 10% chance that company finds a way to use this against us in the future vs the 100% certainty of more guys/gals hitting the street.

this isn’t anything personal against you UgleUAL, it’s just that I feel strongly that the bad times test our integrity as a unified pilot group more than good times ever could. This idea would certainly mean a pay decrease for me, but I believe that fighting for the employees we will stand shoulder to shoulder with for the next 20-30 years is incredibly important. Why wear the pin if you’re not willing to take it in the shorts for another to keep their job?

whaler

What kind of conssesions are we talking about here?

Pro2nd

I understand the reservations of guys who have seen this show before. History does repeat itself. Us younger pilots blowing off the experience and knowledge of our elder peers is a mistake. I was at a regional and on the street for the lost decade and I never want to experience that again or have another pilot go through it. That said, I would support an LOA for a 50-60 hr MPG with a firm 6 month expiration from dos with a rock solid no furlough provision. I would also volunteer for a 6 month 50 hour MPG with a no furlough provision if given the opportunity. The UPA MUST remain untouched. It’s taken way too long to claw back some of the concessions our profession endured after 9/11 and we are still a long way off.

Nucflash

Those numbers are appalling. Just remember what was done for you last time by your leadership (the furlough fund was from the membership, not leadership). So that answer would be effectively NOTHING. Oh, wait....they did give you LOA 25.....

Remember that, and this time don’t let the present leadership treat the next round of furloughees the way you were treated. I really hope you make it this time around....

ugleeual

Are you an LEC rep? If not, why are you even discussing this on the forum? What you may think is doable and morally just doesn't really matter...

OUR job is to fly airplanes from pt A to pt B... they did not hire US to come up with ways to make the company more competitive or streamlined... and I don't come on this forum to figure out ways to save United. The company lurkers love to read posts like yours... willing to give away what pilots spent decades trying to have written in the contract.

crflyer

What did he say that he’d like to give away?

ugleeual

"Our contract was not written with a downturn and (potential) upturn like this in mind. As evidenced by both our union and upper management, maybe there are areas/LOAs we can look at that would be acceptable to both parties in the event we get a “V” shaped recovery."

"I’m not willing to categorically shut off my mind to a staffing strategy that would keep more of us on property."

Hmm... you honestly think the company is going to give ALPA something for free? In order to negotiatiate with management ALPA must be willing to give up something. I'm simply saying don't negotiate any modifications to the UPA.