Agreement In Principle
05-16-2022 | 08:13 AM
#251
On Reserve
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
wow. What a joke.
most pilots in base don’t live in the cit-they live in the suburbs. If they DO live in the city, they live in posh or hip or gentrified neighborhoods
Take Houston, for instance-the woodlands and Sugarland is basically the IAH pilots Lounge
or ORD, most people live in the outer suburbs like Naperville.
you can take your Buffalo Manifesto somewhere else.
most pilots in base don’t live in the cit-they live in the suburbs. If they DO live in the city, they live in posh or hip or gentrified neighborhoods
Take Houston, for instance-the woodlands and Sugarland is basically the IAH pilots Lounge
or ORD, most people live in the outer suburbs like Naperville.
you can take your Buffalo Manifesto somewhere else.
American cities are garbage. That's the real reason we commute. High crime. High taxes. Working people are treated as criminals while actual criminals raid. Do you travel? Other cities are nice. Other cities are clean and organized and safe. American cities by comparison are trash. I don't care about scope. I don't care about pay. I don't care about positive space commutes or other carve outs. I only care that we come together as a people to defend our way of life against all domestic enemies. I won't live in a place where a 60 year old woman can't walk home alone at 2 am. It is the role of government to eliminate threats. Safety and happiness are primary goals. Pre-crime is necessary. Weak bureaucrats wax about justice they can't possibly achieve while honest people cheer for threats removed. Only God can do justice against violent criminals. Our only hope in action is to remove threatening individuals before they do more harm. Killing to prevent harm is justified. Killing because of harm is not justified. This is how you are judged by your government and this is how you must judge your government. The death penalty is immoral. Pre-crime is moral. Remove all threats and make our cities safe. When this is done the commuter problem will be solved.
05-16-2022 | 09:10 AM
#252
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,464
Likes: 0
For me and many others, once your schedule has been posted, most of us have been booking company seats to and from work for the entire month. This solves a lot of issues. If something comes up and we get sick for instance, we cancel the seat as soon as possible. Like mentioned, depending on if you wait too long to book or on reserve, you may run into a issue using PS. Once the aircraft gets so full, for example, , it may become impossible to book due to previous company policy on positive space seating when an acft gets to a certain fullness, even if the flight shows a seat available. In these cases we call our pilot assist who has authority to book the seat anyway. We can't book first class seats only economy class. 24 hours of we can upgrade to comfort plus (business) if seats are available. The company does, however, close off a few seats that only gate agents can manipulate in loading the flight so as to accommodate injured people and a few upgrades for pax. Being able to project the seats has been a win win win for company, commuters and pax. In our commute clause, the company often would positive space us if our primary flight was canceled, over sold etc. In these cases a pax might be removed to get a pilot on. This company sees less "tactical sick," unable to commute, we get to work less stressful and a pax isn't inconvenienced by being booted to a later flight. As I stated, one base closure, one type of aircraft retirement etc. Is all our took for a bunch of guys to become a commuter.
Should we shun DEN commuters who commute to SFO because they want to fly a 777 in SFO?
or should we shun ORD 777 guys who instead of displacing to another aircraft in ORD decided to commute to EWR/IAD/SFO for 777?
It's all a moving target and a complex network most of which we have absolutely 0 control over as pilots. Commuting is generally how someone start or ends a career. and if you didn't start or end it commuting, suffice to say somewhere in there you will have commuted for one reason or another. It's not feasible for everyone to just pickup and move everytime the airline opens/closes a new base, gets bought out, merges ,etc.
05-16-2022 | 09:13 AM
#253
Line Holder
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 874
Likes: 45
A great example of this is our LTD. It is compared to by other airlines pilots who don't understand the minutia. Is it taxable, is their retirement contribution, how much are the premiums... but from the outside looking in you just see a number $15000 vs $11000 per month. There are better LTD plans but it isn't a real comparison without the fine details.
05-16-2022 | 09:30 AM
#254
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,776
Likes: 63
Does DL have PS commute on long call? That could be an issue because that’s a defined rest period. I’m trying to figure out how DL got around that?
05-16-2022 | 09:44 AM
#255
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 2,852
Likes: 106
Because it's not a duty period. Positive space does not equal duty. We get positive space passes for vacation when the company makes big mistakes. Using them does not put us on duty. A deadhead is duty, positive space is not. It's duty when the company is forcing you to travel. Choosing to live in a different area from where you work isn't the same.
05-16-2022 | 09:55 AM
#256
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,776
Likes: 63
Because it's not a duty period. Positive space does not equal duty. We get positive space passes for vacation when the company makes big mistakes. Using them does not put us on duty. A deadhead is duty, positive space is not. It's duty when the company is forcing you to travel. Choosing to live in a different area from where you work isn't the same.
05-16-2022 | 10:03 AM
#257
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 2,852
Likes: 106
Corret. And they are not calling you.
You are not required to be resting during a rest period. You just have to be free from company obligations. The company doesn't care how you get to work. How is that different than listing for the jumpseat? They "know" you are on the jumpseat too.
05-16-2022 | 10:06 AM
#258
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,776
Likes: 63
good point but there’s no language that the faa can just point to and say your not resting in that scenario because there’s nothing that says management has to look at jumpseat listing in long call scenarios. We’re talking long call only with these issues. What we don’t want is the faa looking at counting commuting as duty again because that almost happened.
05-16-2022 | 10:12 AM
#259
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,776
Likes: 63
A pilot listing for a flight is not the same as the company interrupting rest.
Corret. And they are not calling you.
You are not required to be resting during a rest period. You just have to be free from company obligations. The company doesn't care how you get to work. How is that different than listing for the jumpseat? They "know" you are on the jumpseat too.
Corret. And they are not calling you.
You are not required to be resting during a rest period. You just have to be free from company obligations. The company doesn't care how you get to work. How is that different than listing for the jumpseat? They "know" you are on the jumpseat too.
Not all rest periods are considered equal. Known rest periods are a bit more restrictive. That’s all I’m saying and the 12 hrs is a known rest period.
05-16-2022 | 10:13 AM
#260
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 2,852
Likes: 106
Some people seem really confused about positive space vs deadhead. FAR 117 only refers to deadheads. Anything that happens outside of an FDP doesn't matter. An airline could get rid of nonrev travel and allow everyone to book flights for free. Just because you are no longer on a nonrev list doesn't make that flight a deadhead. Vacation passes are a positive space too. Most airlines allow pilots to reserve the jumpseat. That's the same as positive space, but it's just a worse seat. Still not a deadhead. Granting pilots a guaranteed seat is not the same as telling them to take X flight at X time (aka, a deadhead). FAR 117 does not differentiate a jumpseat from positive space from nonrev.
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