But I thought it was important to look back at the past decade to get "the whole picture"

Just found this Neal quote:

Really doesn't matter, but it sure is fun. The test will be when UAL pilots are on the stand if I can poke fun at them too and still enjoy it.

 

You know the truth is that Neal is probably a hell of an awesome guy and super smart as well. I don't blame him for helping him present the info the way he did.

This just sort of lets you know he really does get it, but in this case, he isn't on the right end of the argument, so he's just being selective.

 

Opinion and personal preferences are useless. I'm sure to a domestic rj pilot, the lifestyle of a widebody FO seems quite appealing. For me, today 737 CA is best for my situation. I don't have a lot of day off requirements, and I can front load my b fund with time and principal. As my kids get older, the bes seniority and days off of a widebody FO will have more appeal. So what?

As far SLI goes, the same applies. One seat in and of itself is not better than any other, except to the point that the individual pilot decides what is important. It's not about your actual seat, it's about the number of choices of seat you have to choose from based on your seniority. I've read a lot about the career expectations at UAL of being able to hold widebody Captain for x number of years before retirement, but no one has mentioned that the same expectations existed at CAL. The junior wb Captain at CAL is 20% seniority; the junior wb Captain at UAL is 15% seniority. So even with fewer wb aircraft, there was greater opportunity on the CAL side. ***I only included 777, 747, and 787 in those calculations and left out the 767. I am on the CAL side, and I will admit that is a bit misleading to say that we have wb Captains at 60% (2005 hire date), even though it is technically true.***

 

I've also read a bunch of nonsense about upgrading out of seniority. You know there is no such thing. The CAL Captains are not unusually junior than the UAL Captains. The junior nb Captain seat is within 2% system seniority of each other. Nothing significant about that. All that to say, is that when you filter through all the bs, both airlines offered roughly the same career options as the other. The only new dynamic with the combined seniority is the ability to bid a base the requires a shorter commute, or none at all. I know it's been said that CALs bases suck, and frankly, that's what I thought when I applied here. But having moved to Houston from SoCal in 2005, I can't see myself going back. We have made quite a home here; good friends, good schools, good church, good dog park, and ok beaches (but the food and entertainment in Galveston is awesome). My point is, just like seat assignment, the quality of a base is in the eye of the individual pilot.

I enjoy reading the posts from both sides. It mirrors politics, sports, and religion in the sense that everyone thinks that if everyone else would just see it objectively, they would see it my way. It's kind of comical when you think about it. That said, in my mind are three scenarios...one where I get a bump in seniority (staple furloughees), one where I get screwed (furloughs going ahead of active pilots), and what I think will actually happen. I'll say it again for the record, the committees that represent our particular sides are charged to do just that. Even though we're in arbitration, it's just another form of negotiation. Ask for the moon, settle for something less. Whatever comes of this, I will accept without animosity toward my fellow pilot. I hope we can all say the same while the outcome is still up in the air.

 

Well.....that's certainly one way to rationalize it.

 

And that's the point. This whole SLI is a process of rationalizing why one group should make out better than the other. The above quote was a response to the rationalizing previously put out by UAL pilots about why they deserve better seniority.

Kind of like the whole "right sizing" rationalization. You can't say one side was right sized for a merger, and completely ignore the fact that the other side also parked 63 737-3/5s. It doesn't make sense.

 

That's not opportunity. Its VARIABILITY. This also means that there are more narrowbody Capts in the top 20% at CAL than UAL.

Just because you have a different bidding pattern doesn't mean anything. CAL has fewer bases that are much larger, which promotes that kind of variability in the bidding.

 

What a bunch of nonsense. Have you ever considered that you're not on the "right" side. Or - which is absolutely the case here - that there's more than one "right" side and that both sides have valid perspectives and rationals. There are no absolutes in this debate and their won't be in the award either. And if you don't think the outcome is "right"...your just SOL.

 

The award (interesting choice of word) will be absolute itself, and every debate has absolutes. You can not alter the number of wb aircraft in your fleet and historically that has been the single biggest factor in deciding ISLs.


In recent history:

USAir/Am West, category/class/ratio
DAL/NWA category/class ratioed,
Pinnable/Mesaba/Colgan category/class DOH (that's the most recent ISL under the "new" ALPA merger policy).


You can argue that 767-400s are the same as 747s until you are blue in the face. You can debate career expectations until you are blue in the face. You can debate who had better financials until you are blue in the face, but remember USAir was on the verge of liquidation, they had zero career expectaion and they got category/class ratioed. Pinnacle bought Mesaba and Delta told Mesaba they were eliminating 75% of their fleet, they had zero career expectation, and still the arbitrators went with category and class and DOH. Turns out career expectations are really hard to quantify and adjust for, but category and class is really easy to count.


There are most definitely absolutes you can't alter, UAL had more WBs and longer longevity on average. Those are absolutes. Argue that CAL deserves credit for better future expectations all you want; it won't change the absolute facts.


But,


I could be wrong,


AND


it doesn't matter 'cuz the future is bright regardless or at least I like to believe so