Regularguy

"since Boeing failed to deliver the 787 with ETOPS 330 as originally intended."

So how come the 777 flew the route from the west coast and is still doing so today? Where's that hole or is it Boeing's failure?

Again I believe the 787 will work itself out through use, kind of like UAL's crack revenue management algorithms. Of course rather than improve the revenue side up to the industry standard Jeff is proposing almost a billion dollars in cuts.

Could someone please tell us where he expects to get that kind of money from? One thing which is proven over and over again is outsourcing does not necessarily cut costs. What is does is reduce financial risk by moving the investment dollars to another entity.

Too much posting for one week.
Happy Thanksgiving!

cadetdrivr

Happy Thanksgiving!

p.s. Follow the link in my post above....it takes you to the "Great Circle Mapper" and you can see the ETOPS hole and draw your own routes and ETOPS circles to your heart's content. FWIW, that UAL 777 which lost an engine en route AKL-LAX a few years back (and used every minute of its 180 ETOPS) was a little further north on a route that avoided the hole.

Regularguy

cadet

"that UAL 777 which lost an engine en route AKL-LAX a few years back (and used every minute of its 180 ETOPS) was a little further north on a route that avoided the hole."

Now you get my point. The 787 was promised and yet still can't fly the current route from the coast. However, yes they are planning it for the near future. The Mechs in SYD have all been either trained or are in training for the 787. And don't be surprised if the 777C model shows up sometimes in the spring on the LAX-SYD route.

Probe

Great circle from the west coast to Hawaii goes north of the 180 minute ETOPS no go hole in the Pacific. IAH to Auckland goes right through it. Unless you have 300 minute ETOPS, you have to do a big detour around the hole.

The 787 should easily do LAX to Auckland, or at least as good as the 777.

Boeing promised 330 ETOPS, an didn't deliver. I don't believe any of UAL's (either black or blue team) 777's have this either. Some 777's do, with certain versions of GE engines.

SVA402

United Airlines parent plans $2 billion in cost cuts - chicagotribune.com

This says SEA-NRT is going away completely, so no 787 on it now?

SUX4U

They are also completely dropping NRT-BKK-NRT? First the capacity drop on the SYD runs from a 744 to 772 and now a flight that is always a packed 744/722 is going away completely? Seriously scratching my head on this one.

intrepidcv11

Have no fear, The Star Alliance is here! Once again the bean counters have no problem assuming that ANA and Thai will share all the revenue we would ever hope to possibly get. Btw double daily to Houston from Narita, but not ORD? Oh yeah that's right ANA just started second NRT-ORD.

Dividend by 2015! Something all the troops will rally behind. Well played Jeffery.

alaskadrifter

I've often wondered how United is even in business after time and again they give away their flying to the Death Star.

APC225

Wait until the next plan. When we get the 100 seaters UAL pilots fly them as required, but for another company who owns all other aspects of the operation. Like reverse outsourcing. They run the stations, the maintenance, rampers, gate agents, but we fly them. Will bid for them in a vacancy bid just like any other equip. Complies with contract for us to fly them. Nothing says other aspects have to be run by UAL.

flybynuts

Here is the best way I can explain it. I don't agree with it or even like it and believe it is short sighted by our mgmt team.

We fly this route and bank about 15-17k off of it in a perfect world. The last several years we have had "the numbers" showing that 80% of the time our "pilots" deviate, fly fast, maintenance or whatever (think bad customer service and etc... causing some of this too) and we are making 3-7k on average. ANA pays us 6k regardless. So looking at numbers over the last 3-4 years we would do better with ANA for profit. That's the big picture.

The failure occurs because we can't run a good operation (pre and post merger) and instead of going internal to educate and correct they go for the easy fix and money.

It disgusts me and actually makes me worry about our mgmt direction for the long-term.