FLYZERG

Yes he mad.

FODhopper

But will they be happy in their jobs at Mesa? I'll take this job at AWAC and its current uncertain future over the working situations at other regionals. Should it go away...I'll just find something else...that makes me happy.

whoareyou311

Yeah that makes total sense..you are one D**B ******...I left that place for another regional and I would be captain there right now and I'm glad I left...that place is dying and if you can't see that you truly are a genius! NOT!!! For all my friends that I have that are still there I feel sorry for, but you I have no sympathy

fosters

Didn't you go to Pinnacle?

FODhopper

Your name calling really put me in my place...I feel so awful. If it was such a bad experience for you, why do you care so much to come here and dump on it when you could write negative posts in threads about your current airline.

However in all your rage you really didn't read my post.

You don't know anything about me...airlines was not my only professional flying experience. Having spent plenty of time flying for teetering mom and pop 135s or various corporations with flight departments that disappear w/o warning...in comparison to many places...AWAC is a good place to work...its a good solid job, with good work rules, and really good health care....this D**** B**** is a really healthy one.

The uncertainty always sucks...but its no different than other places, so I just don't get too excited about all this gossip. I've heard this talk "dying" talk since I've been here. If there was truth to it then it would have fell apart already.

ChipChelios

AWAC pulled a rabbit out of their arses when the United flying went away...get ready for another rabbit.

CAirBear

Here is my insight and experience. This is long, but I feel insightful.

I've been here for 11 months and 14 days. Just passed MV/LOE so basically off probation now. Starting June 15th I will be making more money (2nd year pay) than basically ever other regional FO with possibly the exception of Horizon (extremely comparable pay scales). It truly is amazing that guys everywhere else won't even top out (usually after just 4 years) at what a 2nd year FO here makes.

I have had an awesome time here and have had a blast. I have only flown with a couple guys who weren't fun (that is going to happen anywhere), but all in all have made some great friends and truly enjoy coming to work and the people I get to fly with.

I was on reserve for 3 months and then held a line. I was RSV under the old rules so I can't say what it is like now, but I only had I would say a week where I got abused. From what I hear now it is pretty rough on RSVs but the time on RSV is way down. A buddy of mine just off OE ended up doing 1 month and a week. I think some guys are even getting lines right off the bat in bases like LGA.

I am based in ORF now and after a year bid 44 of 80. It seems every month (with the exception of the last couple as upgrades are on hold due to FO shortage) we were upgrading 8-12 a month. I think all in all I've moved up 89 spots in 11 months. Not shabby whatsoever. Heard upgrades should continue again in September/October.

There is lots of attrition happening here, albeit not extreme, but it's steady and I don't see it slowing. There are a number of FOs who are being hired at Airways and others. With the elimination of TPIC requirements at most legacies it's not as critical to upgrade as it was in the past. Of my new hire class of 12 I think 6 are still on property. A lot of have already made the jump. (Disclosure 3 of those were ex ComAir, but still).

As for why we are hiring so much it's hard to say. I have two trains of though regarding it. A. Management expects attrition to absolutely skyrocket to an unbelievable level and are hiring like mad to try to handle it, or B. There is definitely something in the works that require a much larger pilot group. Given the private nature of AWAC and this kinda thing has happened before I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility. Last time I checked AA still hasn't found anyone to give all of those EJets to. I think last I saw (about 6 weeks ago) we had 898 on the seniority list. It could very well be over 900 now.

I get the uncertainty of not having a contract after 2015 and I understand why some would be hesitant, but from what I was told by Rankin, during our ground school a couple weeks ago, even if there is nothing in place (like a new contract with AA or any airline for that matter) this place isn't going to lock the doors and be coput come New Year's Eve 2015. Things will still be operating in some compacith into 2016. Who knows how or what it will look like, but there will still be something happening.

Finally my thoughts on the worst case scenario:

I was hired here with 3000TT of which 2200 was PIC. I was at Cape Air for a year before starting here. I figure by the time things ended (let's be conservative and say NYE 2015) I do not at all feel like I'm going to be royally screwed and or be in a bad position. At the point of judgement day I should be very close to 5000TT and 1500 or so Turbine time. Given the fact no one requires TPIC anymore I won't be sweating all too much with my chances at a major.

The days are over of 500hr (no PIC) FOs. If we still had guys like that then they would be big time screwed after being let go from here after 2 years.

My bottom line:

The attrition at the majors hasn't even gotten started. Given my times and experience in 18 months I would not feel too F'd over if I were to be out of a job. Would it suck and be less than ideal? Of course, but I don't think it's a massive career altering (damaging) event for myself. Of course everyone is in a different position so don't feel that this is going to apply to you.

I ultimately based my decision to come to AWAC because of the pay, benefits and QOL. Despite massive attrition and shorter upgrades I have always felt it's foolish to go to a regional based on upgrade and not for the reasons I stated above. Here is why. This is a true story.

Most junior CAs I fly with who just upgraded had been in the right seat here for 6-7 years. You think they were happy and thankful to be here making considerately more money and benefits than guys at Pinnacle, TSA/Go Jets, Mesa, RAH etc? You can't predict the future and while currently there is lots of movement I feel you should always ask yourself where do I want to be if I am going to be stuck for the next decade? For me AWAC and Horizon were the 2 obvious and the only ones I applied to.

Disclaimer for any Flamers: I seem to get flamed for everything I say on here no matter how big or small hence why I rarely post, but here goes.

Yes I am new and maybe I'm drinking the kook aid, but to me I am glad as hell I'm here over any other regional with much lower pay and benefits/QOL. I look at this career as a realist. Post 9/11 2-4 year roads to the majors were the norm and because of such people accepted what should be illegal wages and work rules. Well now the norm has became 4-8 years (coming down again though) so therefore I feel it's foolish to not owe it to myself (and any pilot) to work for the most money possible and with the best benefits. If they feel they can't handle the stress of possibly being put on the streets in 18 months I understand that completely. Starting over sucks, but given this place has been around 50 years the tract record doesn't hint at this place closing. Then again this is aviation so anything is possible.

FODhopper

Its hard to protect against the flamers...they will flame anyway because their own arguments are not well supported. Very good points made.

When all you nattering nabobs of negativity spend so much time worried about ladder climbing...then you end up at a crappy regional and become bitter about your work and the industry. Don't blame us for trying to have the best life while we are here.

l2flare

well Chautauqua is parked so there's 60 140/5s, and Eagle is, according to the latest round of threats, parking like half it's fleet of 140/5s. So 30 9s and 30 175s are replacing 120 something 140/5s which is a loss of seats. I guess if American does buy 100 ejets it would cover the rest and all of air willey feed. But does AA really think that all the screwed over Leagle and willey guys would go crawling to psa with open arms if they give them 100 ejets?

BTpilot

Sorry to change the subject, but I don't get why all the people dissing air whiskey seem to think the pilots care..

This place has had an "uncertain" future forever. Before we were sold in 1993, UAL basically just said they were going to shut the doors. In 2005, we had zero flying planned. I understand that the regional landscape is changing and this airline could literally close 100% in a short period of time. The point I want to make is that most of the pilots here DO NOT CARE.

Do people think we sit there in the cockpit biting our finger nails saying "Oh my gosh what am I gonna do?!?".. No. We don't.

The environment in my base and with the range of guys I fly with (top 20% in base) don't care about this "uncertainty". The same goes for the occasional junior capt I fly with. So, trust me, you're not hurting our feelings when you sit there and preach behind your keyboard that the "writing is on the wall".