I believe the VX proposal has most losing relative seniority and gaining in longevity. Then there’s some VX pilots who lose both.

Seattle BPL has a Jr CA with seniority # 1304. He is a 2/5/14 hire.

Gaining longevity??? The company is going to grant years of service to VX pilots in accordance with where they land on the final approved list?

Longevity is only good for vacation accrual and nonrev priority anyway.

To the first question.....Absolutely NOT!

And any VX guys will never have ANY change to their longevity regardless of where they are placed on the list. They will always be at a disadvantage to their longer tenured AS cohorts.

Lets look at what each proposal does to the junior CA at VX.

In the VX proposal 20 CA from the snapshot are pushed below the CA stovepipe line which then places 20 AS FO's into their position.

In the AS proposal the number of VX CA's pushed below the CA stovepipe line as of snapshot is increased to 137 with the same number of AS FO's then residing above the stovepipe line.

Obviously the VX side is much more exposed to harm with the possibility of base closure, vacancy bids, and probable reduction in the Airbus fleet, if not a complete elimination of the Airbus. Not to mention operating with a management group who has the ultimate latitude with ZERO scope protections.

You all need to find some hobbies other than internet. Like finding out this sweet screen name was still available.

Internet: you won!

Well done sir!

The final award published in the Alaska Pilots company website. 2/2014 for Boeing.

First post win! :D:D:D Admins, you can close this thread now.

Thank you thank you, I couldn't have done it without the continuing frustrations brought on by our dear leaders!!!! Thank you and goodnight!

So Ala$ka was already taken..?

You’re looking at a future estimated list. I’m going off of the last updated seniority list. You also have to remember that prior to the snapshot date VX was the one growing. There was more to gain at VX. Then AS management accelerated that growth and then slammed on the brakes. Now they’ll have to slam it on again as we don’t have the proper staffing for line bidding.

Either way, management is loving that our unity is slowly breaking apart. Just wait until they open the bases and planes etc.

It’s not an estimate. The Seattle, June, Base Position List has a 2/5/14 CA on it. The seniority lists are only updated twice a year. They’re out of date the day after they’re posted. AS was experiencing some of its greatest growth in terms of hiring from 2013-2016. We had plenty to gain at AS. There’s no reason our unity should be breaking apart. It’s up to each one of us to not allow things that are out of our control to destroy a solidified pilot group.

That may be valid in a PBS system, but AS doesn't have that. In a line bidding based system, EVERY number senior to you has a dramatic effect on your "bidding power." It can certainly mean the difference between a 20 day off line bidding mid-continent turns and double BOS layovers that require a commute the day before, a hotel in between and a commute at the end with 12 days off.

Some more numbers: Taking the #1 VX pilot

VX proposal has this pilot moving from 0% on the list to 4% down after sli.
The AS pilot directly below is also at 4% after, but previously held a spot 7% down the AS snapshot list.

AS proposal has #1 VX pilot moving to 22% down after sli.
The AS pilot directly below is also now 22% after previously holding a spot 38% down the AS snapshot list.

*using 2850 as post sli denominator

Nope, If the total group grows and you have the same relative seniority you will be able to hold the same trips as the total number of lines will be adjusted (more hard lines, more build ups, more reserve). Line bidding in the family since 1998.

I lose 10% on the list and lose 33% of my longevity. Please tell me how I'm hitting the lottery?? I would have been better off with DOH!

I’m referring to the VX side.

How on earth can a SLI produce a decrease in longevity for anyone?

Better to lose 10% than being on a street corner. Best case, y'all would have been in the mix with dysfunctional B6. You think eskimo is dysfunctional, spend some time over there. Y'all won the jackpot so quit your whining. I'd go with DOH but a Swingline is more suitable.
Some pilots are sharp as a bowling ball, that's why.

I’m on the VX side

Easy because the ALK proposal does that. I’m sliding back 10% on the list and being slotted with ALK pilots hired 2.5 years after I was hired at VX. I’ll take my DOH please.

Why was VX for sale?

Everything is for sale for the right price.

Every public company is for sale. When a offer comes in the board of directors has to consider that offer. 3 airlines approached Virgin. Virgin did not put itself out for sale.

Delta wanted to sell y'all as scrap metal but DOJ wouldn't approve so Eskimo outbid blewho.
Robust and thriving businesses just don't wake up one morning and sell just because a potential buyer makes an offer. It's usually because of their inability to compete in the market and/or just weak. I'm just sayin'.

A publicly traded company with a CEO and BOD has a fiduciary duty to their shareholders. If a buyout offer is presented at a significant premium to the current share price, it has to be considered.

Y'all is a hick. Writing "just saying" btw is ignorant AF.

This. Public companies (almost all airlines) are actually already "sold" when the shares are issued in the first place (> 50.00%). After that it's just a matter of who buys how many shares.

Why does anyone bother engage these idiots? It’s obvious they haven’t read S-10s, SEC filings, the acquisition documents, the SLI transcripts, etc, etc. They’re just making crap up, or regurgitating rumors and nonsense they hear in cockpits as fact. For example, Iif you read the documents, Alaska approached VX first. Once VX’s board decided to sell, they went out and whipped up competition eventually gaining four more parties that drove the price up. They were hedge fund managers after all and knew the game.

The basic problem with some posters on here is that they are angry they aren’t guaranteed a windfall from AS acquiring VX. We are all just pilots flying from A to B and back. Whether your company makes a lot of money, acquires someone, merges, gets acquired, or fails, or gains routes and makes more money because someone else fails, it’s got NOTHING to do with you. Alaska did well for a long time. So what, it’s got nothing to do with how well the pilots flew. You didn't outfly the boys at Pan Am, TWA, etc. Alaska acquired VX, guess what, once again it had nothing to do with how well you flew. AND, get this, just because MANAGEMENT acquires someone doesn’t mean PILOTS get any benefits. A lot of guys on here seem to think there was something in this merger for them. Nope, your just a pilot. No different than a pilot whose company failed. Or who got acquired. ANY corporate level business decision could be good or bad for pilots. We are all just in it for the ride. That’s how a career as labor works. You want to make personal gains through corporate acquisitions, you’d best join management.

I guess what you mean is you lose 10% relative seniority and are slotted with AAG pilots with 33% less time on property. You don’t lose longevity because of that, presumably your pay/vacation accrual are still based on original DOH, let me know if I’m wrong. FWIW I think VA is the reasonable party here.

Also AAG overpayed for something they didn’t even want and now everyone is butthurt.

A lot of folks here would be wise to read and heed these words.

Yes, but it’s much easier to walk around thinking you’re a sky god, thumping your chest proclaiming that you’re an OG (original goober) and pretending like the pilots of the acquired company spent their days praying to be hired by your company while knowing they’d never be good enough.

You probably need tweezers to make use of a urinal if things like built vs bought or hired vs acquired even crosses your mind let alone passes your lips.

Well said.... Sadly, there are some folks on here who consistently and continuously ignore the facts and logics as presented, in favor of their rabid and emotional protestations about the "other side" getting ahead at their expense...

Let's see how long this takes 3.. 2.. 1.. (Little bit of psychology here.. Lol)

Now that's some funny sh** right there!! Lol

I guess if VX guys made up bag tags that said "DRAFTED NOT SHAFTED!", some of our AS brothers would just totally lose it!!
I kid, I kid : ))

“Tagged and bagged by the sagged”

Took you 6 hours to come up with that, huh? Lol

Proud to be a OG! Can't wait to to bid the bus out of SEA and do the north south flying the VX people hate. It's the best! Now if they would only bring back my MD80.

Heck the bus might become the new MD80. North south bird. I'm just not going back to a round dial Boeing flying SE. Did my time. OG's Rock!

Lighten up, Francis!