WN buying AS?
#31
#32
OTZEagle1
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 409
Likes: 0
I think SWA fleet diversification is likely now, if not a foregone conclusion.
1. Boeing let them down, bigtime.
2. The elephant in the room now is what if the max got grounded AFTER it had replaced many/most/all of the NG's? I think this is a wake-up call for ANY single fleet operator (could happen to the other guys too).
AS is probably not an ideal acquisition target if fleet diversification is the goal, although they have buses, and more bus order positions in hand.
1. Boeing let them down, bigtime.
2. The elephant in the room now is what if the max got grounded AFTER it had replaced many/most/all of the NG's? I think this is a wake-up call for ANY single fleet operator (could happen to the other guys too).
AS is probably not an ideal acquisition target if fleet diversification is the goal, although they have buses, and more bus order positions in hand.
Thanks Av8
#33
MARK MY WORDS. THE MAX WILL NOT BE AIRBORNE UNTIL AT LEAST FEBRUARY 2020. MINIMUM. First thing we will have to read about on APC is that pilots are receiving and actively learning about MCAS. When you start reading that, place you stock purchase bids at all Boeing operators and at Boeing itself. Until then, fuhgeddaboudit.
#34
As of early September, Alaska will be returning 3 Airbuses, still love the NEO variant, have 40 Maxes on order and think that a dual fleet "could" work but may steal a deal with Boeing in light of 346 souls lost. Here's the deal...If it isn't a NEO, that Airbus will go in due time. NEOs can even be gone if the MAX ever gets off the ground which is anticipated by Wall Street in 2Q20 so plan accordingly. Long term, IMO, 30 Airbus NEOs and the rest Boeing. Ever wonder why the "Proudly All Boeing" decal hasn't been removed?
#35
Banned
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 9,347
Likes: 329
One full year of grounding is kinda ridiculous, considering we know it was because it was only linked up with one AOA sensor and then started to fire once that one sensor malfunctioned. That malfunction started a failure mode with a stick shaker on the CA side and erroneous speed/altitude values. We know now once the flaps came to 0, MCAS started to fire and would continue to do so with the malfunctioned AOA. Either pull the speed back and flaps to 1, or cut off those trim cutoff switches. Again we know this in hindsight.
The fix is simple, and Boeing has already said they will link MCAS to both AOA sensors. Both sensors would have to sense/read a high alpha value to get MCAS to operate. And once it does, it’ll fire one time with a limited amount of nose down trim. No more tug of war. In fact, if it was linked to both sensors, neither crash would have happened because MCAS wouldn’t have operated.
Now if we want to discuss Boeing’s coziness with the FAA, the FAA allowing too much reign at Boeing, should maybe reel them in, that’s all great discussion for future changes. But this one MCAS problem is fixable, Boeing is ready, and “testing” the fix is in November. There’s no reason to keep delaying the grounding once the fix is ready and implemented + tested by the feds.
As long as Trump leaves the tariffs on the Airbus and tariffs on China, the ungrounding of the MAX with EASA and CAAC can easily become political - not based on safety. I could see a case where the FAA is ready to lift the grounding, but other nation regulatory authorities say no. And if their nations build the Airbus and are benefiting, with very very little MAXes in Europe, why should they be in any hurry to lift a competitor when their own product has a tariff on it? Or they can simply say we want more time to study the Boeing fix and results. This IMO is why the industry is projecting lifting the MAX in Feb/March. Maybe even Q2. (That would suck). Ultimately, I don’t know if it’s a realistic goal to have one universal un-grounding of the MAX. One chosen date the whole world is okay with? All it takes is one nation to say no.
A319/320s don’t have a future here, the lease returns are happening. The future of dual fleet would be NEOs or go back to all 737s. Time will tell but Boeing will give $$$$ sale deals to sell the MAX en mass once it’s flying again. If we’re bettin’ in Vegas IMO we go back to an all Boeing fleet.
The fix is simple, and Boeing has already said they will link MCAS to both AOA sensors. Both sensors would have to sense/read a high alpha value to get MCAS to operate. And once it does, it’ll fire one time with a limited amount of nose down trim. No more tug of war. In fact, if it was linked to both sensors, neither crash would have happened because MCAS wouldn’t have operated.
Now if we want to discuss Boeing’s coziness with the FAA, the FAA allowing too much reign at Boeing, should maybe reel them in, that’s all great discussion for future changes. But this one MCAS problem is fixable, Boeing is ready, and “testing” the fix is in November. There’s no reason to keep delaying the grounding once the fix is ready and implemented + tested by the feds.
As long as Trump leaves the tariffs on the Airbus and tariffs on China, the ungrounding of the MAX with EASA and CAAC can easily become political - not based on safety. I could see a case where the FAA is ready to lift the grounding, but other nation regulatory authorities say no. And if their nations build the Airbus and are benefiting, with very very little MAXes in Europe, why should they be in any hurry to lift a competitor when their own product has a tariff on it? Or they can simply say we want more time to study the Boeing fix and results. This IMO is why the industry is projecting lifting the MAX in Feb/March. Maybe even Q2. (That would suck). Ultimately, I don’t know if it’s a realistic goal to have one universal un-grounding of the MAX. One chosen date the whole world is okay with? All it takes is one nation to say no.
A319/320s don’t have a future here, the lease returns are happening. The future of dual fleet would be NEOs or go back to all 737s. Time will tell but Boeing will give $$$$ sale deals to sell the MAX en mass once it’s flying again. If we’re bettin’ in Vegas IMO we go back to an all Boeing fleet.
#36
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 278
Likes: 0
From: Captain
good rumor but the more likely version is
SWA "sucks it up" until the MAX is back, all those years of smart financial management provides them with the ability to do this.
MAX comes back and SWA resumes its growth/etc
SWA reviews other aircraft types aka A-220, etc
SWA "sucks it up" until the MAX is back, all those years of smart financial management provides them with the ability to do this.
MAX comes back and SWA resumes its growth/etc
SWA reviews other aircraft types aka A-220, etc
#39
Prime Minister/Moderator

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 44,858
Likes: 658
From: Engines Turn or People Swim
But they won't un-certify the entire plane just "because". Too much political and economic blowback.
#40
OTZEagle1
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 409
Likes: 0
MARK MY WORDS. THE MAX WILL NOT BE AIRBORNE UNTIL AT LEAST FEBRUARY 2020. MINIMUM. First thing we will have to read about on APC is that pilots are receiving and actively learning about MCAS. When you start reading that, place you stock purchase bids at all Boeing operators and at Boeing itself. Until then, fuhgeddaboudit.
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