I haven't gotten through all the transcripts because I can only take so much BS at a time. I have to say that all parties are stretching the truth. I think the biggest stretch, so far, has been Jeff Koontz. Total BS. Most truthful so far, another westie, Ken Holmes. When asked about the MOU he said he didn't like the language. When asked if he tried to change it he said yes. He said the Hummel pretty much told him it is what it is. When asked if he still told the west to vote for it he said yes, even after they had a a chance to change their votes.

 

Ok read that very carefully. It states that it nullifies any collective bargaining agreement which is what? That contracts. This does not in anyway specify the nullification of a binding arbitration result. Bear in mind that the arbitration result is a separate function. The award states that it becomes effective upon entry of a new collective agreement. It was not subject to either of our current contracts or else it would have been placed in effect then.


WD at AWA

 

The binding arbitration is embedded in the TA. The TA has never been completed and this kills it. Read Captain Hogg's(US management) comments when he refused David Braid's grievance. Sums the MOU up just like I understood it.

"h. US Airways agrees that neither this Memorandum nor the JCBA shall provide a basis for
changing the seniority lists currently in effect at US Airways other than through the process set forth in
this Paragraph 10."

Can you tell me with a straight face you thought this included the Nic?

I know you guys think you have been screwed and maybe you feel that turn about is fair play. I just wish you'd be honest about it.

 

Ok between you me and the fence post, Lyle has zero input into this matter as he is just one of the pilots and gets to make no decision one way or the other.

Tell you what with a straight face? I think you are misunderstanding what I am saying here. The MOU did not have to say the nic it. What I am saying is that the award hinged upon and new collective agreement and the MOU is a new collective agreement.

WD at AWA

 

Funny, the usapa officers and committee members didn't agree on what 10 h meant or who wrote it, yet you have a complete understanding.
There is also paragraph 19, which allows for parts of the mou to be invalidated:

Paragraph 24, shall remain in effect after the Effective Date even if this Memorandum is subsequently deemed to be unenforceable or nullified for any reason, and that these provisions are severable from the other terms of this Memorandum.
So it is possible 10h is invalidated and the rest of the mou stays. 10h "Severable" if the judge wants to do it.

 

They were dancing in court just like the west was when they said they were duped. Right. After 7 years of fighting this it was only after the vote was held that they figured out the Nic wasn't in the MOU and sued. What a crock.

If you actually read the MOU, it's pretty clear. WD, you might not have a high opinion of Hogg, but he is a member of US management and I'd bet he didn't write that denial himself. It's very clear. Now, if Silver sees it that way is another question, but the one she seems to favor most in this thing is the company's lawyer.

101. In August, 2013, in response to Section 22.C protests filed by Phoenix based pilots , US Airways stated as follows:
This will acknowledge receipt of the letter of protest you filed
pursuant to Section 22.C of the America West Pilots' Collective
Bargaining Agreement concerning the July 1, 2013 seniority list
posted by the Company. In that protest, you contend that the
Company is obligated to implement the Nicolau Award as soon as the
MTA/MOU becomes effective. That contention is meritless, and your
protest must be denied.
Section 22.C of the America West Pilots' Collective Bargaining
Agreement only applies to disputes regarding a West Pilot's seniority
relative to other West Pilots as set forth on the West Pilots seniority
list. Challenges to the East/West integrated seniority list, which will
be created after there has been a merger and the federally-required
McCaskill-Bond seniority integration process has been completed, are
beyond the scope of Section 22.C.
Moreover, even if the Section 22.C process applied to disputes
regarding the future East/West integrated seniority list, your claimthat the MTA/MOU amounts to a single labor agreement obligating the Company to apply the Nicolau Award immediately is contrary to the express provision in the Transition Agreement (Section XII.B)
that any of the Transition Agreement's provisions "[m]ay be modified
by written agreement of the Association and the Airline Parties
collectively."
By its terms, the MOU constitutes a written agreement between
USAPA and the Company which modifies the provisions of the
Transition Agreement relating to implementation of an integrated
seniority list. Paragraph 10.h. of the MOU specifies that "US Airways
agrees that neither this Memorandum nor the JCBA shall provide a
basis for changing the seniority list currently in effect at US Airways
other than through the process set forth in this Paragraph 10." The
Paragraph 10 process provides for seniority-list integration in
accordance with the standards and procedures of the federal
McCaskill-Bond law, and that process will not even begin until after
the merger has been consummated. Modifying the seniority lists
immediately, as you have requested, would violate the MTA/MOU.

 

My opinion of Hogg and Bular is irrelevant as it pertains to this discussion. I fully expect the VP's to deny grievances as they hope the issue will go away with that denial. Some to them do but never the major ones and those proceed to arbitration.

I think usapa did try and end run where again they stand to gain while bringing harm to the minority class however the award still stands as a separate function. Lets look at it objectively, the east gains in terms of dollars and by taking all the upgrades while using the minority class as furlough fodder. That same exact minority class that brought jobs into this mess now lose them to people that were not even on the property and had no expectation of ever returning.

WD at AWA

 

Usairways appeal to the 9th in the DJ case (case where Silver says the 9th tied her hands) is scheduled for oral arguments Dec. 9th

leonidas.cactuspilots.us/9th_Circuit_Silver_Appeal/Dkt_39_Order_Hearing_Dec_9.pdf

Of note is the fact the original 2-1 panel of the 9th Addington 1 appeal have asked for and taken jurisdiction. IOW the justices that decided the west case was not ripe by 2-1 want to get involved in the companies Declaratory judgement appeal.

 

So they have cost usairways pilots over $650 mil since their inception, what's $7 mil more?

 

The pension issue should not have cost the west pilots a dime. It was not right that it did.